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-   -   ECU Re-programming (http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2512)

timbo 8th March 2010 12:38

ECU Re-programming
 
Hi all
Given the starting problems I have experienced, I am considering having the ECU re-programmed to by-pass the immobiliser. Does anyone know anyone who can do this? Preferably without needing the whole car :) I have tried Prestige Decodes and Rollingmotion Ltd so far.
I am also trying to find out whether anyone will re-synch the ECU, immobiliser and key once the rolling code has been lost. No luck as yet but the research continues...
Thanks
Tim

Mike 8th March 2010 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by timbo (Post 18380)
Hi all
Given the starting problems I have experienced, I am considering having the ECU re-programmed to by-pass the immobiliser. Does anyone know anyone who can do this? Preferably without needing the whole car :) I have tried Prestige Decodes and Rollingmotion Ltd so far.
I am also trying to find out whether anyone will re-synch the ECU, immobiliser and key once the rolling code has been lost. No luck as yet but the research continues...
Thanks
Tim

Did you try Nick at EVO?
Mike

Sorton 8th March 2010 16:30

Back in the days when my engine was in the BMW, the ECU failed and it was remanufactured by a co. called ATP. The sticker on the ECU shows a phone no. 0543 467466 (presumably now 01543) in Staffordshire. There are other similar repair companies who may understand the workings enough to be able to by-pass your problem areas. Just a thought!

peterux 8th March 2010 22:19

Hi Tim,
sorry to hear your still having ECU problems, as I assume the 'clocks' installation didn't work? What a shame, I thought we'd cracked it.

I have searched many times and never found anyone willing to modify a M52 ECU to remove the immobiliser. (If anyone knows, the're not telling !!)

I have considered two other options but not tested either....

1) get an M50 manifold, injectors ECU and engine wiring loom. No idea if it would work and the twin Vanos would certainly not work correctly.

2) Use an aftermarket ECU. I spent quite a lot of time researching all the options I could find but only a very few can properly manage the BMW twin Vanos. The best match (on paper) is a DTA Fast S 100 pro.

http://www.dtafast.co.uk/S_100_PRO.htm

They actually have wiring diagram for an M52 and I'm sure it will work. However, you're talking a 1k for the box plus a few hundred to get it mapped properly.

...sorry not much help...

...peter

timbo 12th March 2010 10:57

Thanks chaps
After a lot of research (including Nick at EVO) and head-banging (especially from BMW dealerships/Head Office, who won't help because the ECU is not installed in a BMW), I have found someone who will possibly be able to re-synchronise the ECU, immobiliser and key if I post them off to him, namely Paul at RollingMotion Ltd in Caerphilly.
It is only a short-term solution (ie carry a spare ECU set in the Sportster) but at the moment I can't afford the long-term solutions ie (i) use Peter's aftermarket ECU suggestion (ii) get someone to find out why the heck its not working, which will probably involve tracing and checking all the wiring (sadly I have no time to do this myself atm).
Like Peter, I haven't found anyone who will re-build the ECU to bypass the immobiliser.
My impression was that wiring the instrument cluster in gave me more starts than before, maybe more of it needs wiring in....????!!!!
Tim

Mike 16th January 2014 10:49

M52 TUB28 - EWS Delete
 
Hi Tim

Happy New Year

I saw on a post you had moved on to another project using an MX5 donor, but wondered if you still have your Marlin Sportster and are still interested in someone claiming to have resolved the EWS delete on the M52TUB52 ECUU?

Cameron Mitchell (on here as Cammy) has bought a new E39 based Sportster and had been trying to find someone to allow him to run an M52TUB28.

He knew I was interested in this option and has forwarded the contact details of a BMW technician who claims he can do it / has done it?

If you would like his details I'll forward them by email if you PM me your email address.

Regards

Mike

C

peterux 19th January 2014 18:04

Now this does look interesting.....

http://www.cardiag.co.uk/bmw-ew2-ews...9-e46-759.html

I'm no expert but if I'm reading this right it does look like a potential solution?
Maybe this is the solution that Cammy has found?

Cammy 26th January 2014 16:44

Tim/All,

I just got my ECU back from Jason Balbier from BW Auto repairs in Middlesex yesterday. It is a DME 41.1 from an 1997 car and I had the immobiliser deleted, ABS deleted and the Automatic Stability Control (ASC) rev restriction removed. Total cost was 90 including VAT and return postage.

I tried to get a concrete statement from him regarding my original engine (I changed the M52TUB28 to an M52B28 after hitting the same brick wall everyone else did) and the response I got from him was, quote, "ive been doing ews delete for many years so these engines will run and work in other body shells

ews delete started on the
e36 3.0i m3's
e36 3.2 evo mss50
e46 m3 mss54 abs soft cut delete
e39 m5 mss52 abs soft cut delete
e36 ms41 320i-328i with ac working abs soft cut delete
some ms42 and 43
2.5tds from e34 and e36

have removed ews or blanked ecu so can be either programmed to another car or aligned to another key set"


I don't know if this is of any value but if anyone wants to follow up you can reach Jason via, www.bwchiptune.co.uk

CHeers

Cammy

peterux 16th August 2014 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by timbo (Post 18380)
Hi all
Given the starting problems I have experienced, I am considering having the ECU re-programmed to by-pass the immobiliser. Does anyone know anyone who can do this? Preferably without needing the whole car :) I have tried Prestige Decodes and Rollingmotion Ltd so far.
I am also trying to find out whether anyone will re-synch the ECU, immobiliser and key once the rolling code has been lost. No luck as yet but the research continues...
Thanks
Tim


Well, 4 years on and it now looks like you can get EWS deleted on an MS42 ECU for the M52TU engines now on ebay!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-EWS-3-...item233eacaa13


But it does come with the following warning....

"Please note, for an engine transplant into a different chassis without the same electronic subsystems that the ECU expects, the ecu will run in safe mode and a EWS delete is not enough for such a transplant."

So it may still not be a complete solution to using the dual Vanos M52/M54 engines.

It has also raised a concern that I need an ABS delete for my MS41 ECU to stop it running in 'safe mode'?

Is there anyone on here that is running an MS41 ECU without an ABS delete?


....peter

Mike 17th August 2014 11:19

Hi Peter

There is at least one Sportster owner running an M52B28, and possibly a second.
Al Barnes came to Stoneleigh in his immaculate Blue Sportster sporting an M52B28 which he has driven around Nurburgring - so he certainly is not stuck in limp mode. I have no idea of his contact details, but he must be an MOC member, so you could try to track him down via the Mem Sec.?

Cameron Mitchell is also going down the M52B28 route, but whether he has got his engine running, and been able to test whether it will deliver top speeds I don't know.
Maybe if he's tuned in he will let us know?

The ebay advert has not moved the current position on: the caveat says he can not carry out the necessary deletes to allow the transfer of an MS42 or 43 into a non OBD11 chassis.

Interestingly Adem Ergen at Ergen Motorsports claims he can re-write an MS43 ECU to allow an M54B30 to run in an E30, or E36 chassis. I have put down a 200 deposit and provided him with an MS43 ECU plus M54 harness which he says he will use to demonstrate an M54B30 running in an E30 mule, or engine cradle.

Having said that it was 3 months ago, and I am still waiting! A couple of days ago he responded saying he would do it over the next 4-6 weeks. I am not in a hurry so am prepared to wait until the end of September to find out.

I particularly want to go down the route of installing a fully functioning M54B30, as they develop significantly more torque (221 lbs) at much lower rpm (3500) than my M50TUB25 (181lbs at 4200rpm): better still the curve is much flatter and wider than the M50
For a road car Torque is more important to me as I do not like screaming engines that have to be constantly revved hard to get the performance.
Although my M50TUB25 is better since I refurbished the Vanos, it is noticeable how the performance really kicks in above 3,500rpm. From the dyno charts I've seen the M54B30 will easily out perform it, with its wide flat torque kicking in at around 2,000rpm. And the icing on the cake is the fuel economy should be at least as good, if not better.

If Ergen fail to deliver on their promise (he offered a money back guarantee) I will still swap the M54B30 into my Cabrio and initially run it on the M50's electronics using single on/off Vanos. There is a known proven route to do this. It will not develop its full potential, but the additional cube will still give a lot more torque, and even without DISA working will still deliver it lower down than the M50's inlet manifold allows.

The long game is that the engine will be in place ready to convert to an MS43 ECU and run twin variable Vanos and DISA if a proper solution is ever made available to the general public.

Mike

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterux (Post 58637)
Well, 4 years on and it now looks like you can get EWS deleted on an MS42 ECU for the M52TU engines now on ebay!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-EWS-3-...item233eacaa13


But it does come with the following warning....

"Please note, for an engine transplant into a different chassis without the same electronic subsystems that the ECU expects, the ecu will run in safe mode and a EWS delete is not enough for such a transplant."

So it may still not be a complete solution to using the dual Vanos M52/M54 engines.

It has also raised a concern that I need an ABS delete for my MS41 ECU to stop it running in 'safe mode'?

Is there anyone on here that is running an MS41 ECU without an ABS delete?


....peter


peterux 17th August 2014 21:14

Hi Mike,
thanks for your very comprehensive reply and good to see that you are still looking for the Holy Grail of engines for your Marlin !!

My plan was to install my M52B28 complete with the EWS and key fob, etc assuming that would be a sure fire way of making everything work.
But now I see comments about ABS delete so I'll need to do a bit more research on what the ABS signal is to the MS41 ECU.

Cameron (Cammy) posted above that he has got a reprogrammed ECU with EWS delete AND the ABS signal deleted. It would be nice to get an update?
I don't know of the Al Barnes Sportster; do you know if he built it himself?

Good luck with your M54B30 engine install, I do hope Ergen come up with he goods. That will be a very quick car !!

...peter

Mike 18th August 2014 20:48

Hi Peter

There is a photo of Al Barnes Sportster at Stoneleigh on the MOC - Thread title, unssurprisingly - Stoneleigh Pics - No.1 posted by Scott H.
I'm pretty sure he said he had built it himself.

Sorry tried to copy the photo URL and post here, but it came out MASSIVELY too big.
Do you know how to copy from the MOC site and control the size?



Mike

peterux 19th August 2014 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike (Post 58700)
Hi Peter

There is a photo of Al Barnes Sportster at Stoneleigh on the MOC - Thread title, unssurprisingly - Stoneleigh Pics - No.1 posted by Scott H.
I'm pretty sure he said he had built it himself.

Sorry tried to copy the photo URL and post here, but it came out MASSIVELY too big.
Do you know how to copy from the MOC site and control the size?



Mike

Hi Mike,
ah, now I've seen the photo, I do remember seeing this car but didn't get to see the owner.
But reading the various BMW forum threads on engine swaps, the ABS signal (or lack of...) does seem to be a common problem with this version of the ECU. It's not exactly a 'limp mode' but more of a 'redline' restriction to about 5000 rpm. I'm now thinking of getting an ECU with the EWS deleted and the ABS signal issue fixed. It will be an easier installation without having to use the BMW column lock and key, and I can probably recover most of the cost by selling my existing matching set of ECU, EWS and keys.

at least, that the current thinking :-)....

...peter

Mike 20th August 2014 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterux (Post 58664)
Hi Mike,
................good to see that you are still looking for the Holy Grail of engines for your Marlin !!

I had not thought about it like that, but you are absolutely right.I feel like Monty Python's Black Knight, with no legs, and down to one arm at the moment, still trying to carry the fight!

The bottom end grunt of an M54, which is ideal for a daily driver, is so tantalisingly close, yet so far away! - I know what is required: I even have someone adamantly telling me he can do it (Adem at Ergen Motorsport), yet I still do not have the working ECU in my hands............... ....................patience, Michael, patience.

C'mon then, I'll fight you with just one arm !

Your M52B28, with an easy to reprogramme ECU, is looking a good bet at the moment!

Cammy 3rd September 2014 21:16

Hi Guys, Cammy here!

Sorry for the radio silence on the Marlin build and the delayed response to the post.

I do indeed have the M52B28 but it is yet to fire up in earnest. So far I have had it turning from an aftermarket ignition key and my own wiring interfaced with the ECU but I decided to remove the spark plugs and not put fuel in the system as there is still a bit of work to be done for the prop shaft and exhaust and I didn't want fuel in there with the potential for some hot work!

When I got the ECU 'chipped' the ASC rev limit was removed so I am hopeful that once I get the fuel in and give it a try there should be no limp mode to address.

As far as sources for getting the ECU and immobiliser issues sorted I think Craig Ramsay found a great guy who can sort out a lot of these issues. The guy is called Chris Ransley and he works for CR M-Tech. His e-mail address is chris.crmtech@btinternet.com or call him on 07949 464 954.

I am about to start work on the car after a few months off - one of those 'disillusioned with the build' breaks and a summer of focussing on golf and other things. Aim is to get the engine/dashboard wiring finished and a bit of the body work and floors to let a local garage sort out the exhaust and prop shaft. Aiming for that to be done over the winter so that I can fuel her up and have a test run up the drive in Spring.

Cheers for now

Cammy

peterux 4th September 2014 20:04

Thanks for the feedback.

...peter

morris 13th September 2014 08:18

Over the past week or so I've been doing loads of background reading on Megasquirt MS3 and come to the conclusion it is by far the easiest and most cost effective way of over coming all these OEM ECU issues people have with the later 90's engines. The only thing that causes an issue is controlling the VANOS. MS3 can do the on off VVT on the M50 based on different parameters but I think variable the continuous VANOS seen on the later M52 and M54 onwards requires a bit more electronics know how though you could just run it as on/off.

The other benefit of going this route is complete control over your tuning for any future upgrades or engine swaps.

I've costed it up including all the test boards at around 500 as a kit from the US, maybe a bit more if you want to also buy a wide band O2 sensor. my current plan is to set one up on my current engine and use it as a learning opportunity for either building an M50B30 or swapping out to something different entirely.

you'll spend well over 300 just getting a tuner to do a one of map for you where as this can be infinitely tweaked over time

Mike 13th September 2014 09:28

Ian

I think MS3x runs variable vanos.

Have you seen Hoveringuys three threads? - they are facinating if you are considering going down this route:

He is a bit of an electronics whiz, but not a geek. He started off with an M54B30 running on an M50's ECu, then made his own Vanos controller, but then switched to using MS3x to run variable vanos and DISA.
He's now embarking on a megasquirt set up from the outset, so just what we want.


http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=116803

http://m54megasquirt3.blogspot.co.uk/

http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=320713

I have an M54 engine, ECU and harness if you could use any help?

morris 13th September 2014 10:35

Thanks mike, I've read through that M54 megasquirt blog recently but the r3vlimited post was a new one and pretty interesting.

MS3x was the plan so I could do full sequential ignition and injection. not actually necessary but more for the technical challenge.

My plan is to keep to the M50 iron block for the strength and then do the M54B30 crank, rods and pistons trick to up the capacity. undecided on whether to keep the M50 head or stick an M54 one on. I'll probably leave as is initially. I'm starting to hijack the thread now though so leave at that ...

Mike 13th September 2014 17:55

Are you planning to race your Sportster? I know M54B30 seem prone to oil pump problems - otherwise the weight saving of the M54 is worth having.

The M54 head does not go on the M50 - the water passages are all different, and I think the studs are different too.

Why not swap the complete M54 over?

I am really undecided what to do with my M54 - I bought it with the idea of stroking the M50 like you, but I really like the torque the M54 with DISA generates at low revs.
It would make a Cabrio a lovely rapid tourer - Cabrios are not built for speed!

Which brings me back to finding an ECU to run Dual Vanos and DISA, so back to the original question?

Megasquirt is certainly an option if you are confident enough about the electronics. If you crack it, I will have lots of questions for you.......!


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