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Go Back   Madabout Kitcars Forum > Mad Build Area > Vintage and Classic Roadster Kit Car Builds

Vintage and Classic Roadster Kit Car Builds For Vintage and Classic era kit cars. Post your build reports, problems and progress here

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  #281  
Old 20th November 2017, 10:58
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Barber Barber is offline
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I am really enjoying this thread. As mentioned previously, the Sabre is something I looked at a long time ago, and concluded it was above my competence level to complete. - I was right. I am now experiencing a vicarious build.
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  #282  
Old 20th November 2017, 11:14
Amir Manzoori Amir Manzoori is offline
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Hi Peter,
As always, I admire your patience, dedication and quality of work. This Royale Sabre, as I see it, will be one of a kind and a pleasure to own and drive. I hope you get rid of your cold and back to the real work, producing the best Sabre.
Meanwhile wishing you and family happy Christmas and New year.
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  #283  
Old 25th November 2017, 21:11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barber View Post
I am really enjoying this thread. As mentioned previously, the Sabre is something I looked at a long time ago, and concluded it was above my competence level to complete. - I was right. I am now experiencing a vicarious build.
Thanks, Barber. Glad you are enjoying my updates. Happy to be your surrogate builder


Quote:
Originally Posted by Amir Manzoori View Post
Hi Peter,
I hope you get rid of your cold and back to the real work, producing the best Sabre.
Thanks Amir for your best wishes!

Whilst staying in the warm waiting for my cold to pass I spent a good few hours studying the BMW wiring diagrams for my BMW 328i engine.
The engine management wiring loom terminates at a 25 way circular multiplug known as the x20. This is very convenient but the details of the individual terminals are scattered across multiple pages of the wiring diagrams.

I've created my own x20 connection diagram from the BMW diagrams. I then checked my spreadsheet with my actual loom and I found only one discrepancy.

The picture below is the 'car side' of the connector that will be spliced into to the main wiring loom, although only 12 wires need to be connected.

BMW x20 connector by Sabrebuilder, on Flickr

I guess the proof of the pudding will be next year when I power up the engine

....peter
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  #284  
Old 29th November 2017, 18:43
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cabrioman cabrioman is offline
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Hi Peter, glad to see things are still ticking along on your build.

Question for you, do you know if the sabre owners club is still active?, I am considering buying a Sabre next year and tried to contact the owners club to join but got no reply, wondered if you knew if it was still going?

Have you seen the 2+2 Sabre conversion thats being done on kitnet, worth a look if you have not.

John
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  #285  
Old 30th November 2017, 06:29
Amir Manzoori Amir Manzoori is offline
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Default Cabrioman searching for Royale Owners Club

Royale Owners club is up and running and the website is www.royaleownersclub.org.uk
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  #286  
Old 30th November 2017, 08:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amir Manzoori View Post
Royale Owners club is up and running and the website is www.royaleownersclub.org.uk
Yeah I had seen the site. I made an enquiry via the contact information on the site to ask if the downloadable member application form and membership secretary address was current before I sent off payment but I never got any response.

I was also wondering if there was an online payment system for membership rather than sending a cheque.

Hence the enquiry to Peter who I know from the Marlin forums.

Iíll drop them another enquiry.

John
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  #287  
Old 30th November 2017, 11:46
Amir Manzoori Amir Manzoori is offline
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Dear John,
I have just informed our club chairman Mr. Peter Gibbon to reply to your enquiries and hope you soon become a member.
Regards
Amir
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  #288  
Old 30th November 2017, 15:45
Amir Manzoori Amir Manzoori is offline
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Hi John,
As peter couldn't get into madabout-kitcars.com he replied to me and you can read it below.

Amir

Amir,
It seems I need a user name and password to reply, does John not have an email address? Feel free to give John mine for any enquiries, and yes he can apply through the treasurer and pay by bank transfer if he wishes.
Kind regards Peter

(peter.gibbons20@gmail.com)
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  #289  
Old 30th November 2017, 19:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabrioman View Post
Hi Peter, glad to see things are still ticking along on your build.

Question for you, do you know if the sabre owners club is still active?, I am considering buying a Sabre next year and tried to contact the owners club to join but got no reply, wondered if you knew if it was still going?

Have you seen the 2+2 Sabre conversion thats being done on kitnet, worth a look if you have not.

John
Hi John,
I think Amir has answered the first part of your question. Thanks, Amir.

Are you thinking of buying a Sabre kit to build or a completed car?

I hadn't seen the 2+2 conversion before your comment but now I've had a chance to have a look it's a very interesting development. Some of the early Royale Motor Company adverts have a reference to a 2+2 model but I'm not aware of any cars or kits produced by the factory. It will be interesting to see what he does about the hood?

...peter
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  #290  
Old 30th November 2017, 21:03
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Hi Peter

Iíll most likely buy a car thats useable and then do project updates to it rather than buy a basket case or build / rebuild from scratch. I am hoping to retire next year and quite like the idea of going off for trips in it. With a Sabre I think it could include the Mrs but with the existing Marlin its a bit too snug a fit for her liking.

I thought the + 2 on kitnet looked interesting. Not that I need the seats but it looked like it would create some useful space behind the front seats. To be honest I have always thought the hood on the Sabre could have been better if it had been a bit bigger ( extended towards the back of the car) so you would assume the + 2 would have to do that. As you say it will be interesting to see how he approaches the hood.

Do you happen to know if there is an electronic version of the Sabre build manual available from anywhere, I would like to have a look at it but searching the web has not turned up a source.

Whats the timescale for yours to IVA, you seem to have nailed most of the difficult development.

Cheers

John
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  #291  
Old 1st December 2017, 09:33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabrioman View Post
Hi Peter

Iíll most likely buy a car thats useable and then do project updates to it rather than buy a basket case or build / rebuild from scratch. I am hoping to retire next year and quite like the idea of going off for trips in it. With a Sabre I think it could include the Mrs but with the existing Marlin its a bit too snug a fit for her liking.

Do you happen to know if there is an electronic version of the Sabre build manual available from anywhere, I would like to have a look at it but searching the web has not turned up a source.

Whats the timescale for yours to IVA, you seem to have nailed most of the difficult development.

Cheers

John
Hi John,
I think the Sabre is an excellent choice for touring. It would be worth chatting to Peter Gibbons as he has done extensive Continental tours in his car. I'll PM you about the Build Manual.
Timescales to my IVA are really just as long as it takes

...peter
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  #292  
Old 4th December 2017, 22:19
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Default Near disaster

The timing cover on the BMW M52 engine has three M6 torx-head bolts that go down through the cylinder head into the top edge of the timing chain cover. I was refitting the cover and following the tightening procedure in the Bentley workshop manual. It said to tighten the M7 bolts to 15Nm. Without checking I assumed that the bolts were M7 and set my torque wrench to 15Nm. As I started to tighten the bolts it was odd that the bolts kept turning without the wrench reaching it's clicking point. At first I thought it was just the new gasket compressing when suddenly one of the bolts gave way and went loose.

Timing chain cover bolts by Sabrebuilder, on Flickr
Timing chain cover bolts by Sabrebuilder, on Flickr

TBH I thought I'd snapped the bolt and was amazed that when I removed the bolt it came out complete albeit stretched by a few mm.
It turned out that the bolts are M6 and the correct tightening torque for M6 bolts is 9-10 Nm but I'm still surprised that these bolts would stretch to the point of fracture before only 15Nm.

Anyway, no harm done and I now have a new set of bolts from BMW.

...peter
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  #293  
Old 5th December 2017, 22:38
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Lucky it came out in one piece Peter, could have been a pain if it hadn’t.

John
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  #294  
Old 6th December 2017, 16:32
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MartinClan MartinClan is offline
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As I discovered to my cost, the "core" of a threaded bolt is actually a lot less than the actual bolt size by the time you take into account how deep the thread is. As I recall, for M6, it is less than 5mm. Considering that the strength is related to the area, and that is related to the square of the radius, the thread reduces the strength considerably.

A bit of a rambling explanation but you get the gist...

Cheers, Robin
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  #295  
Old 6th December 2017, 20:16
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John - yes, it was a very lucky escape!!

Robin - many thanks for the explanation
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