Wheel Sizes

Wankyracer · #1 15th March 2012, 14:16

Hello to there to fellow builders,
I am new to this or any other forum, so please bear with me.
I have just bought a Mk 4 Spitfire, as a basis for a Sammio Cordite.

I have stripped the body off, and I am about to strip out the running gear, engine, gearbox etc.

My question is: I want to retain steel wheels, but go up in diameter and width, does anybody know the maximum sizes I could use, without fouling the bodywork?
Thank you.

tlrtone · #2 15th March 2012, 14:30

hello WR, welcome to the forum and the Sammio Build team!

I don't know if there are any finished Cordites out there at the moment, so it is all a bit trial and error.

There is a thread on Wheel sizes for the Spyder (Herald based) which goes through several options with photos of bulkhead and chassis clearance.

I would think with 14" wheels and up to about 80 profile should be fine, any bigger and you will be needing to have a play with the clearance. Then again the Spitfire bulkhead might be totally different!

Mister Towed · #3 15th March 2012, 14:48

Yep, agree with Tirtone. The wheels that will fit your Cordite are whatever wheels you can get to fit.

The biggest steel wheels I know of that have the Spitfire/Herald PCD are MGF spares at 14"

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MGF-MGTF-S...item1c240dca2a

Not what I'd call pretty though...

MGF alloys will fit though (see DaveCymru's build thread) and look pretty good:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/mgf-tf-all...item4ab5384afc

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mgf-Mgtf-1...item3372f4fc5a

Mmm, nice.

The critical thing with Sammios is the diameter of the tyre rather than the size of the wheel: measure the distance between the back of the standard tyre and the bulkhead once you've lowered the front to your desired ride height to see how much clearance you have to play with, then use this handy tool to calculate whether your chosen tyre will foul or clear it -

http://www.kouki.co.uk/utilities/vis...ize-calculator

Good luck with your build and welcome to the (not really a) club.

madmark · #4 15th March 2012, 15:00

We race a Rover SD1, weird wheel PCD!! So what you may ask?

As a consequence of locating suitable wheels which are like hens teeth, discovered that if you buy new wheels, direct from manufacturer, they can drill them to any stud pattern that you may require.

Appreciate buying new as opposed to used wheels is expensive, but it clearly allows more choice.

Hope this helps

davecymru · #5 15th March 2012, 17:46

Welcome to the forum matey, i think a lot of people are looking forward to seeing a cordite being built, so please post plenty of pics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mister Towed

MGF alloys will fit though (see DaveCymru's build thread) and look pretty good:

You'll be after Pat's thread as i've got 15" MGC wires fitted to mine
http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/foru...ead.php?t=3050

The other wheel & Tyre thread can be found below and while it's not necessarily Spitfire focused, it's got loads of interesting hints, tips and links that will be of use:
http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/foru...ead.php?t=3087

Dave

Mister Towed · #6 15th March 2012, 18:10

Oops. Sorry Dave C. I was working from, erm, what was it now? Erm, memory, that's right...

Wankyracer · #7 15th March 2012, 14:47

Thank you,
I will look for the thread, with the Cordite being based on the Spitfire, I think the bulkhead is dispensed with, as it uses the deluxe frame similar to the 2cv base. However, I have not ordered my kit as yet (waiting to complete the rolling chassis first) so I might be completely incorrect on this point!
Many Thanks again.

Wankyracer · #8 15th March 2012, 20:25

Thank you one and all for your reply's.
I needed to know the wheel/tyre sizes because I hope to have set made up by Weller Wheels in Redditch. I intend to fit them with baby moons and chrome trims. I think this will look great, or not, depending on how you like your motors.
Incidently, what size of lowering block for the rear suspension? As any one fitted one?
many thanks

Mister Towed · #9 15th March 2012, 20:43

Baby moons and chrome trim rings is exactly where I would've gone if I'd built a 356 Speedster replica. Should look fantastic.

I've used the 14" wheel lowering block provided by Gary which is 75mm I believe. I've also added in cut down lengths of the top springs to drop the back end another 18mm making it roughly a 4" drop in total.

Having spent a little time talking things through with Phil9 when he dropped in to see me today I'll be reinforcing the Sammio lowering block with a bit of box section steel welded in vertically (I'll post pics once I've done it) as he's found that the block on his gets squashed during ahem, enthusiastic driving, leaving the diff mounting bolts loose. Which is bad. I'd already noticed that mine bowed out when I tightened the diff bolts down so I knew there was an issue there that needed addressing.

Anyway, here's my rear end set up:

The last pic shows the positive effect of dropping the back end so much: no more jacking of the inside rear wheel during spirited cornering.

Wankyracer · #10 15th March 2012, 21:26

Thanks Mister Towed,
Big help your photographs.
Glad you approve of the baby moons and trims.
I will start posting photographs as soon as the build comes along.

Wankyracer · #11 21st March 2012, 18:27

Hello out there in Sammioland,
On a recent post, there was photoshop pictures of the Sammio Spyder in different colours,
Any body know the post or date please.
Saves me a lot of time looking through various posts.
Thank you

lancelot link · #12 21st March 2012, 18:31

Its the ''widened Sammio.....'' thread , page 4

Wankyracer · #13 21st March 2012, 18:45

Thank you,
See you at Stoneleigh?

lancelot link · #14 21st March 2012, 18:50

Yes .....hopefully .....no definitely ....should be !!

We will be there , The Cordite has to attend really , be a disaster if it doesn't...

Mister Towed · #15 2nd August 2012, 18:34

And for anyone looking to pimp their Sammio -

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RARE-SET-O...item20c9457a93

donnysoutherner · #16 2nd August 2012, 19:49

Currently scratching my head about wheel and tyre sizes for my Cordite. Might have to see if I can source an MGF wheel and tyre to check the fit. Was going to go for 14" Minilites but want a bit wider tread than standard 155s.

Looking at pictures of the herald base, the bulkhead on the spit base won't cause the same problem to go with a bigger wheel.

Mister Towed · #17 2nd August 2012, 20:07

According to the research I did, the widest tyre you should fit on a 4.5" rim is a 175. I've gone for 175/70/14's on my MGB wires, while Phil J has fitted 175/80/14's to both the cars he's built. I think they look great and they don't stiffen up the steering, but you can fit 15" MGF alloys relatively easily (same PCD and bolt pattern as the Triumph, but I believe you need rear spacers) which allow much wider tyres if that's what you desire.

If you haven't already seen this comparison calculator it's a very useful tool for checking the height and rolling diameter of tyres you're thinking of fitting -

http://www.kouki.co.uk/utilities/vis...ize-calculator

As a rule of thumb, 175/80/14 are the tallest tyres I've seen successfully fitted to a Sammio, so if what you're considering is any taller they'll probably foul something.

donnysoutherner · #18 2nd August 2012, 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by micha

to get this typical" historic look 15" ones would be correct...or as a cheaper alternative 14" ones with high profile tyres. 13" ones , as per original triumph spec. look too small and too "modern" compared to the rest of the car.

but now it comes to the driving:

with 14 or 15" wheels the final drive ratio will increase...means much poorer acceleration...considering the small engine size used in most sammios, its the "death" for acceleration.

But given diff ratio and screaming engines is a much talked about problem, surely larger wheels would help a bit? I'll find out soon as I've just bought a set of MGF 8 spokes on ebay! Ebay; can be your friend or your enemy!

davecymru · #19 3rd August 2012, 07:56

I changed the original Triumph 13's for a set of 15" wires, but to be honest after living with it for a while and also seeing other cars i'm not too sure of "the look" and i think that if i did it all again i'd go for 14's with a slightly higher profile tyre.

As far as performance is concerned i've got a 2L and with a 3:63 diff my instruments are not far out (checked with GPS!) and my performance is more than fine. For now

Edit for Micha - i used to have a 4:11 diff fitted with the 2L (don't ask) and it was like driving a Diesel! I had amazing acceleration up through the gears, but 1st gear was basically redundant as i could pull off easily in 2nd and sometimes 3rd and then i was in 4th by just over 25/30 and at anything over 50 the engine was screaming away.

Psycho pops · #20 3rd August 2012, 07:59

"but the sammio is made for fun, driving on curvy (mountain) roads ...so most important, imo, is acceleration."

Blast thats us flat landers out of the running then.
Pops