Berlinetta Restoration 2015

[8 Valve Ed]

Picked up the hinge for the bonnet today, 16 gauge stainless, a tad over 2" wide and 72" long. I was a bit concerned the flats would be too narrow but they seem well wide enough. Tomorrow I hope to collect the sheet aluminium for the bonnet so there will be no reason not to crack on with that aspect of the project.

I am still unsure how I am going to make the transition from flat to curved profile but my usual trial piece with scrap will hopefully reveal the technique.

I haven't decided whether to use dome headed solid aluminium rivets or 4mm stainless dome head cap screws. I very much like the way solid rivets pull the panels together and make a really rigid joint. I think it's because the rivets expand in the hole and that makes the whole thing so much more rigid.

[8 Valve Ed]

Having lost the last two weeks to MOT rectification on my ex wife's car, replacing half the braking system in less than ideal conditions, I resumed work on the Berli yesterday. I fabricated the new nearside 'B' post ready to install it today but ran out of MIG wire at the last minute. I reverted to stick welding, nothing wrong with that, but messier and not as quick/easy. Will post some pix soon.

This morning I welded the 'B' post in and buffed up the welds, I was about to break for lunch when a chap peered into the gloom of my garage, wondering what the angle grinding was about...

My visitor asked me what I was working on, he was very interested in the build. Much admired the rolled aluminium panels and the rest of the car too. He told me he was working on a similar project and that he had some experience of car building.

His name is Mark, from near Rugby. He was involved in the building of the Dunsmore - Jaguar specials of the early to mid 90's. Apparently they built about 15 of these cars, until DVLA decided they were a manufacturer. Being a manufacturer meant a big step up with all sorts of issues like crash testing and stuff, so they packed it in.

http://www.classicmotor.co.uk/dunsmore.htm

My visitor, Mark told me that sadly, Bill Hines the originator of the Dunsmore, passed away some years ago. He told me how they made the curves on the bonnet by tacking the panel to a welding bottle and rolling it on the workshop floor!!! All high tech stuff!

Bearing in mind my little workshop is tucked away in a very remote corner of Cumbria, I do attract some very interesting visitors. We had a really nice chat about interesting cars.

[8 Valve Ed]

I have a little puzzle, my brake master cylinder is from a BMW, I don't know which, although I think I was told once...

I have started to pipe up the brakes and the old chestnut of which port goes where arrises once again. It would have been very convenient if the front brakes were connected to the back part of the master cylinder because that has two ports, and the back circuit to the single port at the front of the master cylinder.

However, given the rear outlets are marked 20 (mm?) and the front outlet is marked 19 (mm?) I am assuming the front outlet should go to the front brakes via a 'T' piece and the rear outlet with one outlet port blanked off, to the back brakes. That assumption because usually you need a greater pressure to the front brakes, the back brakes just assisting, also you don't want the back brakes locking up well before the fronts have started to bite.

I have made a photo of the m/c; beside the 19 and 20 markings there is a letter, my query relates to the letter, does it indicate H and V to indicate F and R (front and rear)?

Also, can anybody explain why there are two outlet ports on the outlet marked 20?

Any suggestions will be appreciated, while I could look a word up, H and V are difficult to look up! ...Just thought, perhaps I just look up Front and Back in German?

Anyway, any suggestions still appreciated.



Ordered the gaskets for the engine today, may start assembling that tomorrow.

[8 Valve Ed]

Vorderseite means front...

zurück apparently means back. Mmmm, still unsure.

Knowing what little I do about German they probably have a special word for 'Rear Brakes'.

... Like, Bremse hinten is this the H?

Still think I would rather have the smaller piston going to the front brakes. Unless of course somebody here knows otherwise?

Reminder; the brakes are Mk 3-4-5 Cortina, disk - drum; while the master cyl is BMW.

[JG]

When I did my Sumo I used a Cortina master cylinder. It was the other way round to yours though with the two outlets at the front and the single one at the rear.

The twin outlets fed the front brakes, one for each side. The single outlet for the back brakes. The pipe for this one goes to one of the rear cylinders and then back out again to the other rear cylinder over the live rear axle, hence why only needing one outlet.

Hope this makes sense.

John

[8 Valve Ed]

Thanks John, makes a lot of sense. In a way I would prefer to use the dual outlets for the front and the single outlet for the rear, however I am concerned about line pressures.

I just calculated it and the difference in piston area (output pressure) is 10% between a 19mm bore and a 20mm bore.

20mm bore = 314.16 Sq. mm.

19mm bore = 283.63 Sq. mm.

My guess is that BMW will have used a very small rear piston at the back, which are also probably disks. I have about 17mm piston (not actually measured it) drum brakes. So to keep the pressure differential safe I feel I should be keeping the bias towards higher pressure at the front, else I may have trouble with back brakes locking up in the wet even under light braking. I once had a Mini with a seized pressure limiter at the back, that was a regular for swapping ends unexpectedly!

While with a Mini that's kinda acceptable, with a Marlin I think I may loose friends and passengers pretty quick. LOL

[peterux]

Originally Posted by 8 Valve Ed

I have a little puzzle, my brake master cylinder is from a BMW, I don't know which, although I think I was told once...

I have started to pipe up the brakes and the old chestnut of which port goes where arrises once again. It would have been very convenient if the front brakes were connected to the back part of the master cylinder because that has two ports, and the back circuit to the single port at the front of the master cylinder.

However, given the rear outlets are marked 20 (mm?) and the front outlet is marked 19 (mm?) I am assuming the front outlet should go to the front brakes via a 'T' piece and the rear outlet with one outlet port blanked off, to the back brakes. That assumption because usually you need a greater pressure to the front brakes, the back brakes just assisting, also you don't want the back brakes locking up well before the fronts have started to bite.

I have made a photo of the m/c; beside the 19 and 20 markings there is a letter, my query relates to the letter, does it indicate H and V to indicate F and R (front and rear)?

Also, can anybody explain why there are two outlet ports on the outlet marked 20?

Any suggestions will be appreciated, while I could look a word up, H and V are difficult to look up! ...Just thought, perhaps I just look up Front and Back in German?

Anyway, any suggestions still appreciated.



Ordered the gaskets for the engine today, may start assembling that tomorrow.

That looks like the BMW master cylinder that came off my BMW 320i donor car. The two ports nearest the pedal pushrod are for the front disc brakes. The single port is for the rear brakes which were drums on the 320i. The rear brakes also have a pressure reducing valve (BMW part number 34331152494) between the M/C and the tee piece in the rear brake line.

You can see it here fitted in my Marlin Sportster.....

Brake line sand fuel lines by marlinpeter, on Flickr

Sorry that this old photo is a bit blurry. You should be able to get the pressure reducing valve from any scrap e30 BMW if you need one.

I hope that helps?

...peter
P.S. i don't know what the letters stand for

[8 Valve Ed]

That's the one Peter! together with the servo, off camera...

It never found it's way onto the Roadster, I had intended to fit it after it went on the road but that never happened of course.

Thank you for clearing it up, especially the photograph, a picture tells a thousand words! I will go search for a pressure limiting valve, shouldn't be too hard to find.

I am still struggling to find the rubber seals for the header tank, my local BMW place quoted £100 + for a kit... LOL Perhaps if I find a regulating valve I will also find another master cyl and header tank, with seals.

[peterux]

Originally Posted by 8 Valve Ed

That's the one Peter! together with the servo, off camera...

It never found it's way onto the Roadster, I had intended to fit it after it went on the road but that never happened of course.

Thank you for clearing it up, especially the photograph, a picture tells a thousand words! I will go search for a pressure limiting valve, shouldn't be too hard to find.

I am still struggling to find the rubber seals for the header tank, my local BMW place quoted £100 + for a kit... LOL Perhaps if I find a regulating valve I will also find another master cyl and header tank, with seals.

You probably know that servo is off a BL Metro which were a bit limited in the amount of boost. (lots have upgraded to Dual Diaphram boosters from the USA, but that's another story...)

The seals should be available separately and should be about £5 each. (Part number 34311160133)

Just been looking again at realoem.com and BMW fitted 19,05/20,64MM M/C up to 07/1986 (like yours) and after that fitted 22,20/17,46MM. I don't have my Sportster anymore so I can't tell you exactly which one was fitted. The pressure reducing valve goes with the later 22,20/17,46MM master cylinder so you may not need one on yours?
Maybe other BMW Sportster builders will be along to comment as my memory is a little hazy from about 10 years ago

[8 Valve Ed]

Peter, sorry for the delay replying, been a bit distracted.

Yes I am aware of the dual servo but I feel the car being so light, circa 700Kg and my being well used to non servo brakes, even prefer them, it shouldn't be an issue.

Thanks for the part number of the seals, I will follow that up, if my local dealer can't (or won't) supply is there an on-line source of BMW parts?

For now I am going to try the conventional layout of the rear piston for the front brakes and the front piston for the rear brakes. I think the rear piston area will be reduced by the shaft which links the front and rear pistons, so that will reduce the effective piston area. I may even do some pressure tests just to see what happens.


Now for the bad news, I have found that my 'best' engine block isn't so good after all. I have been de-greaseing and cleaning it carefully. Now it's cleaner, I have discovered the bores are badly scored in their lower half's and worse, #8 cylinder sleeve has dropped by 12 thou. My engine man isn't too concerned about the scoring but suggesting topping the block on both sides to get the deck down to the top of the liner. We discussed trying to pull the liner back up the block but I am apprehensive about that it seems it can take 20 tons force to move them, and that's down, with a good face to push on. To pull one up would need a special dolly and there is very little room to play inside the crankcase.

I do have another SD1 block, so tomorrow I intend to clean it carefully and see which is the better block.

Otherwise making good progress, crept over the 60% complete this week, I think Easter is a realistic target.

[8 Valve Ed]

A friend has just eMailed me to say he has collected a new project today, a Mini based trike which built by Reg Curley in 1968 and turned up in an article in Mini World for March, 1994. Reg has passed away but the trike was handed down to his son. However he hasn't made any progress with it since then so my friend followed it up and has eventually taken it on. It's ripe for restoration and I hope to be involved in some way.

It was used for racing but wasn't very successful, largely due to the engine etc. not being very well developed.

[peterux]

Originally Posted by 8 Valve Ed

Thanks for the part number of the seals, I will follow that up, if my local dealer can't (or won't) supply is there an on-line source of BMW parts?

I've always found BMW parts departments very helpful guys. (my local one will even deal with request by email). They once ordered in a 29p part for me from Germany without any extra charge.
However, there is a BMW shop on ebay....http://stores.ebay.co.uk/BMW-Direct-Store You could try them if its more convenient. This part is not currently listed but they do say to contact them for any part not listed.

BTW that mini based trike looks very scary to me!!

[Patrick]

That mini trike looks exciting, I assume it's not road legal?

[8 Valve Ed]

Hi, the Mini based trike is really nice, I saw it on Sunday and had a really good look. I am still digging trying to find it's origins. It's purely a track trike, it would originally have been use alongside sidecar outfits. Once it's back in running condition it will be racing in the British Historic Championship alongside three wheeled Morgans, other three wheel specials and historic sidecar outfits.

Here it is with my two boys at the helm! It was hard prising them out of there after the photo shoot I can tell you...



This is what they get up to... The Morgan is running on Methanol, the Berkly is a Mini based special. One of my better snaps!



I have been hard at it doing numerous jobs on the Marlin but it's been extremely cold for the last few days, the cold seems to draw all my energy, when I have finished about 9pm I am deadbeat, a little supper and bed.

Today I have cleaned the small parts of the engine ready for the build this weekend. I have cleaned both SD1 blocks and finally decided to run with the one with a dropped liner, it's only 12 thou and the head gasket does not grip on the liner so I will take a chance. The other block has several bad dings in one deck right where the sealing ribs of the head gasket are, so it either needs decking severely or find somebody to put some dabs of TIG weld in the dents. I have taken the bulkhead and pedal box out to paint them, I will probably fit the engine and gearbox first before I re-fit the bulkhead and pedal box.

[8 Valve Ed]

Today I tested the radiator, one of 'those' tasks I have been putting off. I had gradually gathered all the gear I needed and decided since it was such a nice morning I would tackle it.

I suspected it would leak because the water pump had been trying to drill it's way through. When I collected the car the water pump shaft was almost touching the core where the damage is so I was expecting the worst.

Apart from the fact the water pump was far too close, I later realised the main cause was that the back axle moves forwards and backwards as the axle rises and falls, in that order. That isn't unreasonable but, it moves over 50mm, The Rover SD1 propshaft which was fitted only telescoped 25 to 30mm meaning that on full bump the engine was pushed forwards up to 25mm, into the radiator. I know the suspension has been at full bump frequently because the propshaft has been gouging bit's out of a crossmember.

I have moved the engine back by 125mm (5 inches) so that won't happen again!

Anyway, I have a few pix of the operation on the rad. Four of the core tubes were damaged by the water pump and had been rather badly soldered. The Rad is actually in quite good condition, it has been specially made by Serk, with their label on it and it's own serial number. I ground out the bad soldering with my Dremmel type tool, I tried to melt it with my Weller gun but it wasn't hot enough and I felt the blow lamp might do more damage than good.

I had already soldered two of the tubes before I took this pic.



This was my setup with a pressure test using air inside the rad and soapy water to test for leaks. It's easier than filling the rad with water, especially when you are expecting to have to solder.



This was the result after I had finished soldering, there were no more leaks from the damaged area, even though I took it over 15 psi.



This is what it would have looked like if it had been leaking! This was only a tiny leak but it created a lot of pretty bubbles.



After lunch I switched to painting mode... I prepped the bulkhead and gave it it's first coat of paint.



All in all a great day, very satisfying. The rad will have to be watched but I'm pretty confident it will be OK. Once the dust settles I may have a new core fitted but probably not this year.

Tomorrow I have a little welding to do under the scuttle. The brackets which hold the scuttle on need trimming and final mounting a bit better than they are. I am planning to build the short motor this weekend. I have the block to hone and polish up the big ends but otherwise I think everything is ready.

[Patrick]

I like your bubble sculpture Looking good

[8 Valve Ed]

Thanks Patrick, I have to admit I was rather taken with it myself. Bit like a Christmas tree, I liked it better because it wasn't a leak!

[8 Valve Ed]

My updated progress chart to the end of January. Just crept over 60% overall.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by 8 Valve Ed

Hi, the Mini based trike is really nice, I saw it on Sunday and had a really good look. I am still digging trying to find it's origins. It's purely a track trike, it would originally have been use alongside sidecar outfits. Once it's back in running condition it will be racing in the British Historic Championship alongside three wheeled Morgans, other three wheel specials and historic sidecar outfits.

This is what they get up to... The Morgan is running on Methanol, the Berkly is a Mini based special. One of my better snaps!

With Bill Tuer at the controls and Maggie his passenger there is nothing that touches this Morgan - he is completely without fear - and Maggie must be too to be his passenger! He'll pass on either side, and go off the track and do it on the grass if he has to. He is just brilliant to watch, and you can not see Maggie as the passenger as she gets down so low! Just fabulous to watch at our local Cadwell VSCC meets.

[8 Valve Ed]

Yes, I miss my visits to the classic circuits, Bill is without doubt spectacular, as you say Maggie is rarely seen above the dash. An interesting 'feature' of Bills Morgan is that on the overrun it spews Methanol out of the carb inlets and sprays any following riders generously. The visors aren't just to keep the wind out.

Oh, and the smell of Castrol 'R'.

Once we get the Curley Trike back in competitive condition we will be back.