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Go Back   Madabout Kitcars Forum > Mad Build Area > Sammio Builds and discussions

Sammio Builds and discussions Sammio bodied car builds and specials

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  #61  
Old 12th November 2017, 16:32
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My mistake, I should have written 'Do not feed'.

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  #62  
Old 12th November 2017, 16:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul L View Post
My mistake, I should have written 'Do not feed'
So you are not prepared to have a rational debate & happy to continue to sling insults around.
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  #63  
Old 12th November 2017, 17:53
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And I thought mumsnet was argumentative ...
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  #64  
Old 13th November 2017, 08:12
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I'm happy to discuss it with you Phaeton ...I totally get what your argument is , and you obviously know the kit car world and the Hot Rod world is full of cars with dubious or inaccurate registration issues ...each time DVLA amend the rules , it cleans some of it up and filters out real problem cars .....next years changes will do even more to clean up the system too ... Some of these cars were built at a time when it wasn't really an issue ...I have built cars in the past where virtually nothing was left of the original car , I have built new build cars back in the 90's where the V5 came from a third party donor which provided nothing to the table ...I have ''lost'' Q plate registrations and ''found'' age related registrations to help things on a bit .......it was going on all the time , an open secret , no one was fooling anyone ...... 90% of the Hot Rod world was doing it .....but , as times change , it has meant that the authorities are squeezing this issue , blaming coming in line with Europe , but we are trying to run away from Europe , so I don't buy that ...I just think they want to clean up the situation , make those extra V5's people have in the kitchen drawer harder to be of any value etc... any dormant V5's now are possibly subject to an inspection when resurrected ...so , its all getting sorted out ..kind of ...

I think peoples issue on here is that as a seasoned kit car enthusiast , you seem to have focused purely on registration issues and don't really contribute to the forum on any other level ...If you were a bit more vocal about other subjects , you wouldn't get the ''here we go again'' attitude ...just my opinion , not having a go ..just responding to your comments ....

Ironically , the S*mmio , Miglia , Formosa , Tribute range of cars are probably amongst the 'safest' range of cars in the whole registration debate ....taking advantage of the 8 point rulings and avoiding IVA. ( A big factor in my reasons for starting the S*mmio range in the first place as I could see the Hot Rod world getting harder and harder to survive in on a professional level )

I'd hate to see you banned or blocked , sometimes heated debate can result in that ...You clearly are an enthusiast with passion ..that's a valuable kind of forum member to have on here and I'd be very interested to know you on a more productive level than the one we are on right now ....

Last edited by lancelot link; 13th November 2017 at 08:30..
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  #65  
Old 13th November 2017, 08:25
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Getting back on track ...

If any prospective buyers of the car being offered on ebay at present are reading this ....It might be worth asking the sellers if you can return the car to them for paint after you have fully fitted the body , made the cuts and tweaks they need etc. ...obviously geographical and financial restrictions might not make that practical , but if it was possible , that's the only way I see a paintjob to add any value to the package being offered ...
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  #66  
Old 13th November 2017, 08:47
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Lancerlot Link Nicely worded.

Just to add, over the last few month I have sent 2 old style "blue" V5's to DVLA and both times they have requested detailed photos of the cars they represent before they will issue a new V5 !!!
Recently I'v also come across problems with V5's for rolling chassis.
DVLA now seem want photos of the original car before it was stripped and if you can't provide them the origins of the rolling chassis are in question even though you have all the relevant V5, VIN tag, engine number ect, so be warned.

I think your right they are "closing the kitchen draw" so my advice to anyone starting a build or taking on a project is MAKE SURE there is a PHOTOCRAFIC HISTORY to support your build/conversion.

At the end-of-the-day DVLA have the last word, good or bad !!!!!!

Ideally if your starting a build start a thread on this forum.
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  #67  
Old 13th November 2017, 09:09
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I had a complete Herald sat at the shop and sent the old V5 in to do a standard change of ownership ...the car had been mothballed for over 30 years , so no MOT history or Tax history since the 80's ...the V5 was issued in about 86 from memory...DVLA requested an inspection due to the amount of time off the road , I reckon they suspected it was a 'kitchen drawer' situation and the car was long gone...SCS came along and made an inspection report stating the car was incomplete ( headlight glasses and surrounds and Speedo sat on the back seat ) DVLA issued a letter stating that they won't issue a V5c until the car has a full MOT . I think that they might still have thought the car was going to be scrapped and it was a V5c creation exercise...
The car was MOT'd about 6 months later ...you have an open file for 12 months with case like this before they return your application.

Something that goes to show how things are changing as Micky says , even having a complete car sat there that has all VIN and engine numbers matching isn't always enough to guarantee getting a V5c issued unconditionally ...

Last edited by lancelot link; 13th November 2017 at 09:13..
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  #68  
Old 13th November 2017, 16:54
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Lancelot Link & Micky1Mo - The debate about the new VHI status over onRods 'n' Sods is now over 90 pages, so this is a Hot Topic.

The final wording of the VHI self declaration may catch a few more people out.

But I think the main thing it will do is remove the "I didn't know the rules" defence for anyone who is caught.

Because the draft wording was talking about seeking professional advice if you were unsure what had been done to your car.

I think the final version of the VHI rules are due out this month.

Cheers, Paul.
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  #69  
Old 14th November 2017, 17:55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micky1mo View Post

....Recently I'v also come across problems with V5's for rolling chassis.
DVLA now seem want photos of the original car before it was stripped and if you can't provide them the origins of the rolling chassis are in question even though you have all the relevant V5, VIN tag, engine number ect, so be warned.

I think your right they are "closing the kitchen draw" so my advice to anyone starting a build or taking on a project is MAKE SURE there is a PHOTOCRAFIC HISTORY to support your build/conversion.

At the end-of-the-day DVLA have the last word, good or bad !!!!!!

Ideally if your starting a build start a thread on this forum.
Hi Micky,

How did you solve the problem with DVLA in the case mentioned above (only having a rolling chassis and not the whole car). Did you managed to change V5 and register the kit car?
I will have the same battle on my hands I guess, as I have only bought a rolling chassis after the car was stripped. Can you offer some advice please?

Cheers, Deni
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  #70  
Old 14th November 2017, 19:09
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Deni The issue I mentioned was sorted out mainly because I got the rolling chassis from a Triumph breaker and he was able to confirm (in writing) that he stripped the car to sell me the rolling chassis less engine.
This was backed up with a paid invoice.

DVLA seem to deal with each case as they see fit so advice is difficult.

Do you have a up-to-date V5?
If you do send it off, if you don't apply for a new V5, as getting a current V5 in your name is the first step.
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  #71  
Old 14th November 2017, 19:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micky1mo View Post

DVLA seem to deal with each case as they see fit so advice is difficult.
+1 on that ...I always put a reference to a previous application on the extra notes section ...just in case the person processing it needs a reference to a similar situation to help them identify whats required. ......

I was getting no where with an application a while back , the guy kept calling it a kit re-build and needed IVA ...He couldn't get his head round the whole re-body thing ...
Luckily I phoned to dispute it on his day off , his colleague asked me to run through it and he said , ''Oh , a S*mmio Spyder , I have done a few of those ...I'll explain it to him when he gets back in tomorrow ....''

I actually got an apology letter for that one ...
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  #72  
Old 14th November 2017, 20:15
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Micky and Gary - thank you for the info fellas. I have already transfered the V5 on my name. I have bought the engine and the chassis (with the original plate showing the chassis/body number that is normally attached to the bulkhead) from a well known Triumph restorer, so I hope all will be ok.

Cheers, Deni
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  #73  
Old 14th November 2017, 21:03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaeton View Post
So if you know him it's acceptable? If you don't it's not?
No the first time you came screaming ringer etc ...it was stated that Mick would assist with registration ... as explained before it was simple change on the logbook required but not having changed it first would help him possibly sell it abroad .

The eBay Ad states something with a v5 and another chassis with no mention f a v5 ...you are asking us questions about the what the guy is selling ...we don't know ...hence why I said go and ask him ...

So did you ask him ?
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  #74  
Old 14th November 2017, 22:13
Lucky@LeMans Lucky@LeMans is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelot link View Post
I had a complete Herald sat at the shop and sent the old V5 in to do a standard change of ownership ...the car had been mothballed for over 30 years , so no MOT history or Tax history since the 80's ...the V5 was issued in about 86 from memory...DVLA requested an inspection due to the amount of time off the road , I reckon they suspected it was a 'kitchen drawer' situation and the car was long gone...SCS came along and made an inspection report stating the car was incomplete ( headlight glasses and surrounds and Speedo sat on the back seat ) DVLA issued a letter stating that they won't issue a V5c until the car has a full MOT . I think that they might still have thought the car was going to be scrapped and it was a V5c creation exercise...
The car was MOT'd about 6 months later ...you have an open file for 12 months with case like this before they return your application.

Something that goes to show how things are changing as Micky says , even having a complete car sat there that has all VIN and engine numbers matching isn't always enough to guarantee getting a V5c issued unconditionally ...
I can see this being a problem for older donors in the future. Many older donors like your Triumph that have been off the road for years could need a major restoration in their own right to pass an MOT. Then you would have to strip away all your hard work to get to the rolling chassis that you want to use.

Under the new rules your rusty old donor would technically be exempt from the MOT, whilst your newly created rebody with rebuilt brakes, clean and rust free chassis would need one !! ??

Last edited by Lucky@LeMans; 15th November 2017 at 12:18..
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  #75  
Old 17th November 2017, 15:06
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https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Triumph-S.../122811545116?

Now back on ebay but 2k cheaper this time. If it came with a decent 6 cylinder motor I'd almost be tempted at that price. Need to get on with my Speedster first though.

Just in case anyone who's not familiar with the forum/a troll/etc. asks, it's still nothing to do with me despite the use of pictures of the (silver) car that I built, and the image of the red car still isn't either a Sammio or a Lancia D24.
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  #76  
Old 24th November 2017, 16:36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelot link View Post
I think peoples issue on here is that as a seasoned kit car enthusiast , you seem to have focused purely on registration issues and don't really contribute to the forum on any other level ...If you were a bit more vocal about other subjects , you wouldn't get the ''here we go again'' attitude ...just my opinion , not having a go ..just responding to your comments ....
I think this just came as a perfect storm, I don't often visit the forum, but I do like to lurk & look at some of the amazing work some of you guys do, I also cringe at some of the stuff others do. I had been discussing the issue of kitcars & what it says on the V5C with somebody that day & happened to stumble across this post that same night, so i asked the question & was immediately attacked, it appeared everybody on the site was in support of the fact it didn't matter, which I disagree with as it causes problems for the whole industry.
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  #77  
Old 24th November 2017, 17:11
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I totally respect your reasons ..I agree irregular V5c stuff is causing issues and de-valuing cars ...It's probably the slack attitude towards using any old V5 that has caused the new regulations to come in ...I do feel for guys who in recent times have bought cars on dubious id's ...it was all a lot easier a few years back and people got , and still are in many cases , very complacent .....

I'm not in the ''it doesn't matter'' camp ..because it does ..but I am realistic enough to know the hobby is littered with cars that were built and registered in easier times ...they will be here for years to come ...I just don't feel the desire to 'out' every potentially awkward car ..thats when people get defensive I think ...

Am I in the amazing work , ok work or cringey work category by the way !!
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  #78  
Old 24th November 2017, 19:39
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LancelotLink Again well said

I regularly get customers who have a "iffy" registration and unfortunately there not much they can do about it without putting the car at risk .

My only advice to them is to make sure it's has a current MOT and it's insured properly ie; photos and spec sent to the insurance company so if the worst happen at least your covered as best you can.

Am I in the amazing work, ok work or cringey work category as well. ??
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  #79  
Old 24th November 2017, 23:10
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How can you make sure that an incorrectly registered kit car is 'insured properly'? I'm just curious, and hope that nobody thinks that I am a 'troll'.

For example, imagine a Cobra replica with a purpose built ladder chassis and glassfibre bodywork that the builder had used on old Spartan V5 for to avoid the expense and expertise of going through IVA. Sadly, this sort of thing happens. Would it be insured as a Cobra replica or as a Spartan?

Does sending photos and spec to the insurance company make things OK?
Would it work with a non kit car? Could a Jaguar registered as a Metro be insured?
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  #80  
Old 25th November 2017, 06:43
Mick O'Malley Mick O'Malley is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softfeet View Post
How can you make sure that an incorrectly registered kit car is 'insured properly'? I'm just curious, and hope that nobody thinks that I am a 'troll'.

For example, imagine a Cobra replica with a purpose built ladder chassis and glassfibre bodywork that the builder had used on old Spartan V5 for to avoid the expense and expertise of going through IVA. Sadly, this sort of thing happens. Would it be insured as a Cobra replica or as a Spartan?

Does sending photos and spec to the insurance company make things OK?
Would it work with a non kit car? Could a Jaguar registered as a Metro be insured?
Stating the obvious, I know, but to be legal, car insurance is mandatory on public roads. Without it, if caught, a vehicle will be seized and crushed. Insurance companies aren't noted for their benevolence, to put it mildly. Any tiny inconsistency uncovered in the proposal will have the insurer rubbing gleeful hands in the event of a claim.

Sadly, it's not only the driver who stands to lose. I know I'd be mortified if I injured someone, even if blameless. If uninsured and blameworthy, apart from remorse in trumps, I'd be wide open to litigation. There are plenty of bloodsucking parasites (sorry, ambulance chasing injury lawyers) out there who love this sort of thing, it's their bread and butter. Loss of house? Possible. Bankruptcy? Possible.

Bottom line: honesty is the best policy!

Regards, Mick

Last edited by Mick O'Malley; 25th November 2017 at 06:56..
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