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Progress has been unimaginably slow since I bought parts 1 and 2 of this kit, mainly due to house DIY, wedding and a new baby. With different priorities, I'm trying to be realistic about ever getting this project done.
I'd originally planned to go the Type-R route but having read some of the issues around this, I'm thinking I need to stick with a simpler engine.
Trouble is, it's so long since i bought the kit that I forget which bits are Type-R specific. I think it's just the engine mounts and the exhaust. Does that sound right?
And am I correct in thinking a 1.6 or 1.8 K-series is going to be the most straightforward (and cheapest)?
Depends on what bits you already have. You would need to get a bubble donor for a start. With a good engine. Or T series turbo if you still fancy the power of the honda. But would need to go chargecooler route etc.
Before you make up your final mind about the engine, I would go for a test drive in some.
Put you location with your name. May be a bit late in the year, but I would really recommend it.
Here is a map where everyone that wanted to be know are:
If so, there's a chap nr Southampton with a k-series - might be only a 1.4 though. He goes by the name of daftbadger.
I'm not far away (Type-R), nr Wimborne. I'd happily play devil's advocate and take you for a ride in mine.
What "problems" have you read about the type-r? Other than a few bespoke things (I wouldn't advise using the Marlin mounts, if yours are the same as I was supplied with), there's no problem as such. It just won't be the cheapest route.
How old is your chassis? If it's the earlier design rear end, then you'd be well advised to speak to Big Rich and get the shopping list of parts to resolve the back end - it's about £160 (I think), and from what Craig has said, the difference is massive.
Southampton's pretty accurate. About 10k north of there really.
My brother-in-law lives in Wimborne and we do visit occasionally. So might leave the family there and take you up on the offer of a ride at some point thanks.
The problems/issues that spring to mind are:
exhaust not fitting
hydraulic clutch recommended
engine mounts not great
problem with driveshafts (might have made that one up but I seem to remember someone did them differently!!)
which ecu solution to take
Actually that's not many, and a couple of years ago I probably would have seen them as challenges rather than problems. But also at last one person mentioned the twitchiness of the chassis. And I guess if the chassis twitches I'd rather it did it with 120hp, than just as 200hp of vtec kicks in!!
I suppose the overall issue is that although I'm good at following instructions, I don't have the experience to sort things out differently. So for example, the fact that the spliine of the uj on the steering column doesn't match the steering rack means I need to find a different column I believe. But I'm not entirely sure what I'm looking for and so it brings things to a grinding halt. I just want to avoid things like this as much as possible really.
And my chassis is 2 years old (so big thanks to chrislandy for making me feel a bit better!!). Not sure which type it is.
Beleive me mate. There is plenty of help on this site. To help (give you kick up the a***). I mean help.
We have all been there. Lack of motivation. I'm an IT guy by trade, and never been any good at DIY, let alone build a car when I started. To gain that motivation, I found going out in another car gives you that kick.
And I'm sure if your really stuck, John (alackofspeed) would pop along.
First things first. Get you engine choice sorted. Then we can start on the challenges/problems.
The problems/issues that spring to mind are:
exhaust not fitting
hydraulic clutch recommended
engine mounts not great
problem with driveshafts (might have made that one up but I seem to remember someone did them differently!!)
which ecu solution to take
But also at last one person mentioned the twitchiness of the chassis. And I guess if the chassis twitches I'd rather it did it with 120hp, than just as 200hp of vtec kicks in!!
Exhaust problem is easily solved! make one yourself!! this is what both John and I ended up doing and it onlt takes a few hours
Hydraulic clutch pretty easy! I had some horrible problems with mine but that was down to incorrect hose size
Engine mounts from marlin are fine but you need to add a rear mount to steady engine, lots of photo's of these in various threads
Driveshafts have all been fine (touch wood)
Ecu very simple hondata only way to go
And lastly chassis twitching is easily sorted for about £130 so don't let this put you off
You will be very dissapointed with the 1.6 me thinks
There's a very obvious engine suggestion..... that shouldn't be stupidly expensive, and will tick all the boxes.
Follow the same path as John (Limpabit), and fit a VAG 1.8t engine and gearbox.
Yes it is a good engine. But I'm beginning to find out, it's beginning to cost to get the job done properly. No different to the T16 turbo though. Chargecooler, baffled sump, injectors, fuel pump and possibly fuel tank. All depending on power.
Though engine itself, with box etc was near the £1k mark. This is for 180BHP.
I’m being tempted back towards the Honda, despite thinking making my own exhaust is a bit beyond my current skills, unless I can make it out of MDF!!
It's easy enough to do. If you can't weld / don't have access to a welder, you can always do what a friend of mine did, and cut mandrel bent peices to shape, strap them together with gaffer tape, and then take the assembled creation to a local welder.
Its alright you Honda boys talking up the installation but I lay odds on the fact that if you have a donor Rover, with working components, i.e. engine, G/B, ecu, Speedo, pedal box, engine wiring loom and a whole lot of other minor but significant bits its easier and more straight forward to stick with the Rover until after the SVA.
The Honda installation is not as easy as the basic Rover, is what I am saying not that its better or worse, I am just being honest.
In fact I would go one further and say use an MGF as the donor but that’s a personal choice I would have made if I knew then, what I know now.
I do not expect my 1.8 vvc to be slow, I have talked to 1.6 owners and they are happy with it as a road going car.
If you want track thrills then that's a different technical delivery.
Fit standard brakes, wheels, hubs, lights everything you can from the donor or your costs will soar to the heavens.
The clue is to make life as easy as possible for yourself given the fundamental issue that you will get with the build anyway.
Rear suspension I suggest if you have the 90mm between top mountings upright for the rear you take that issue up with Marlin. They know its dangerous at speed to fit them and should under duress change them for the improved configuration, and that goes for a lot of other builders, complain to the supplier before you fit them, you now know what the effect will be if you continue, its documented widely.
Fitting a hydraulic clutch is a good option but only easy if you have the right bits, fundamentally, if your donor G/B is hydraulic and you have the mounts and the slave; its straight forward. Double the problems/issues and cost every bit you take out of that equation.
Under no circumstances would I advocate anyone trying to close down the column spines onto a smaller splined shaft unless you are a masochist looking for a future ditch or tree to run in too.
I have a spare Rover 200 steering column with two ign keys and a set of clear lens Pug headlights for sale, if you are interested. I am in Somerset so not too close but in the right area of the country.
All this talk about big engine turbos and horse power blowns my brain, how much power do you need, the burning question bit like does size matter.
I know now my head will be on the block of the guys who have more hp than you can shake a stick at.
To be honest I have been out in the T series turbo powered and the type R, and to be quite honest they both leave you with a smile as wide as the Thames estuary, BUT you must go with what you have.
I bought a 216 bubble shape as my donor and I would say that maybe a smallish engine by comparison, though I go out with some Elise owners and in the main its only the high performance guys that I cant keep up with, although I do hit the limiter most times. If I had the choice the 1800 K or better still the 18KT would be nice.
In the matter of engine fitment, I must say the K series just go in very well, and is easy, touch wood no issues for me, I personaly would reccomend that engine choice as they way to go certainly for convenience and cheap fun.
Like any of the guys who drive 5 exi, its when the little boys ans girls in their saxos and vti pull along side its nice to let them beat you off the lights, get to the next set and bury them, albeit slighty childish, but who cares.
I'd back Steve up on his views...mine is a 1.6K and it does fit really easily and the 1.6 on a cable clutch is fine (2yrs, 5K...no issues)
...in terms of power it depends what you want and what you are used to.
My 1.6 is as quick in a straight line as an S2 111s Elise...and this surpised me as much as my mate in his elise!!...and now the handling is sorted it is pretty similar in the bends.
As Colin Chapman stated...bigger engines make you fast in the straights, less weight makes you fast everywhere.
Inevitably, the T16 engine has more power, but is loads trickier to fit, and a lot heavier.....and you don't want more weight than you need in the engine bay of a mid engined Marlin......not sure on the VAG and Type R weights?
...what would I do now if I had the chance again.....probably fit the 1.8K Turbo ....
General comment......
If you've got other commitments of house, family and children, then my advice is take the simplest, cheapest route for your car.
You'll get tremendous thrills from finishing and driving your own low cost, low spec finished car than your hi spec, hi performance unfinshed kit sitting in the garage.
You can always upgrade it in future years when you have more time.
Just my 2 cents....
Peter
(P.S. It took me 5 years to 'finish' my Sportster and i've still got plenty of plans for it now it is registered)
You hit a good point there Steve. You would like now to upgrade a 1.8 now.
But when the like's of me and you was starting out, there was no cars we could jump in to "see" the performance. We only had the silver 1.6 demo to try. Now there is that choice.
At the end of the day, more power = more money & complex. In the short term. Then upgrade in the future. Or just go for it now. But it will cost you in a long run with first engine choice the upgrade.
Go above the 1.6, and your talking hydraulic clutch, MGF gearlinkage, etc.
With a bigger powered car, you can take your foot off. Not that you will want to.
Try now before doing. Wrong time of year though!
My advise. Got for the engine of your choice. Cost. Maybe more in the short term. And take a bit longer due to finance and complexity. But worth it.
If you plan to go on track, then I really wouldn't bother with anything less than 200bhp. If you want drive on the road, then really any engine option will suffice.... but whatever you do, you really, really, must get the suspension modified (assuming you have an early spec pair of uprights). My car was a complete dog to drive at SVA time, but having sorted the suspension it's now an absolutely joy to slide it around on track. 200 bhp and sub standard handling, or 100bhp and great handling - I'd take the latter any day.
I mean help.
