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Ben Caswell 14th January 2013 21:12

You need to check the "file last updated" date currently october 2012 for my car

seanick 14th January 2013 21:29

Hey Paul, that pic would make a nice Christmas Card.....!

seanick 14th January 2013 21:38

Hey Mocha, you've got it! Were all C R A Z Y over here, zooming around in cars we made ourselves,breaking as many laws as we can, just for the fun of it!! Sometimes, I even drive with my windows OPEN!

GazDavies 14th January 2013 21:45


Originally Posted by micha (Post 38987)
you have so many kitcar constructors in terms of seatbelts..why nobody is phoning somebody of the specialists like westfield, tiger racing or sylva to get a professional answer in terms of seatbelt mountings....also the kit constructor ( sammio) should be able to give a technically correct answer. here it seams that the kit builder is left alone to find a solution himselves...very poor.

Since when has Westfield, tiger racing and sylva been specialists in seatbelt mountings? What technically correct information would you like Ribble (not Sammio any longer, try to keep up dear boy) to give? Its easy enough to state regulations but its upto the builder to make sure that his/her own car is safe.

Mister Towed 14th January 2013 22:00

For our purposes the seat belt mounts just need to be 'secure' to be legal.

To be honest, if you skid into the path of an artic it doesn't matter whether you're riding a unicycle or driving a Range Rover, you've had your chips.

As part of my previous life I had to clear up the wreckage of aircraft from both sides that'd been shot down in the Falkland Islands. If nothing else, ejection seats have 'king good seat belts and they were almost always intact. Sadly, the pilots hadn't always fared so well...

So, build and enjoy your own car. Put the best harnesses in that you can manage. But if a thirty tonne truck turns over on top of you on the bypass even the best racing harness ain't gonna save you. :)

Nike55 14th January 2013 22:27


Originally Posted by Mister Towed (Post 38990)

So, build and enjoy your own car. Put the best harnesses in that you can manage. But if a thirty tonne truck turns over on top of you on the bypass even the best racing harness ain't gonna save you. :)

- but do make sure they are suitably colour-coordinated for the benefit of the coroners photos..

Viatron 15th January 2013 01:30

And being a Tiger owner I can assure you that they know no more than is already available on this forum and possibly the iva manual! I think you miss the point of kit cars, they are built by the owners to the owners specification, we have a proud tradition of she'd building in the uk and generally I think most builders take their own safety fairly seriously, hence my decision to have a full welded cage fitted to my soon to be road legal tiger, not a legal requirement but after years of racing I have seen what can happen so have adjusted by technical spec to take that into account. There will always be those that do stupid things, believe me I've seen a kit car with one of the seatbelt mounts riveted on! But it would never have passed scrutineering, an mot or an iva,

Nike55 15th January 2013 12:49

Some of us might also argue that part of the enjoyment of updating the older type of vehicle, which is not liable to IVA inspection, is to research the available options. If the prudent owner wishes to fit the very latest in safety equipment it is through personal choice and not solely as a legal requirement, the major challenge being to fit any updates in a sympathetic manner.

- or go buy an off the shelf IVA compliant Cobra kit where its all done for you.

Paul L 15th January 2013 18:31

Sorry chaps, it was my own fault really, I tried to be polite and subtle. :rolleyes:


Originally Posted by Paul L (Post 38978)
micha - Welcome to my build thread.
I'm not worried about the V5Cs of the cars in the photos, the context was their front indicators, nothing else.

Micha - To remove any doubt whatsoever...
This is my build thread where I am documenting my build as best I can.
I hope that there may be things on here that might help others with their builds.
I also encourage other Sammio / Ribble builders to guide me & exchange tips & ideas.
It can also be used by my friends and family to see what I am getting up to.

It is NOT somewhere for you to complain about anything what so ever!
If I give you the benefit of the doubt, perhaps you don't know what poor forum form that is.
So if you must continue to rant, please take it away from here and onto the main forum, thanks.

Everyone else - Carry on. :icon_wink:


Originally Posted by davecymru (Post 38983)
... Now back to our main feature ...

And here is something I prepared earlier...

Goldilocks & the 3 front indicator choices...
Well my Classic Mini front indicators arrived in the post and thankfully they do look "just right". :icon_wink:

For the record, the new Mini lens is 54mm diameter vs. 70mm for the rear lens & 25mm for side repeater.

However, there are still two things I need to do before the indicators are ready for use:
The first is to add a separate earth wire that will be connected to the metal rim around the bulb holder.
As these lights were designed to be mounted to metal body work that would provide the required earth.
( This tip came from watching the Mark Evans "A Car Is Born" programme, as he used similar lights. :cool: )

The second job will be to establish the best place, & best way, to mount them onto the bonnet itself.
Whilst certainly not an urgent job, it would make a good little job for me to start working with fibre glass.
As I'd rather see how it all works with something small before I need to tackle something more substantial.
I just need to check the minimum working temperature as it may remain cold outside for a while. :icon_sad:

Stretching the fairy story theme a little bit further…

One hump, or two?
Once upon a time I talked about building a second car with twin humps after I had finished my first car.
That idea quickly when out of the window when the cold reality of building this one dawned on me. :rolleyes:

However, one of the interesting developments in the far away land of 'Ribble Kits & Classics' is humps.
All the future bodies with come out of the mould without humps, which will then be available separately.
This raises the possibility of buying an "extra" hump & retro fitting this car into a twin hump set up. :cool:

I will give this some serious thought, as I am conscious I already have quite an extensive "To Do" list as it is!
Once I have established just how many humps my car will have, I will order some padded heads for them.
I intend to use the company that did Mister Towed's interior, as they did a great job on his head rest.

Cheers, Paul. :)

AndyP57 15th January 2013 18:47

Paul. How's about this for a deal. Now I've got your missing bits organised, if I chuck in a spare hump to say sorry for the delay, you can play with it with abandon, document how you get on and we're all winners :biggrin:

Paul L 15th January 2013 20:29

Andy - Blimey! You have caught me completely off guard there. :shock:

That is a very kind offer, as I know a lot of the issues have been beyond your control.

Thanks, Paul. :)

seanick 15th January 2013 20:43

Re GRP and temperatures, its very forgiving. Anything over freezing and it will go off, just add more catalyst. A lead lamp with a filament bulb our under the job, then covered with a tarp will bring the temp up locally to set it off if you do have a problem.
One thing though if it is cold, mind as you breath out you don't get condensation where you are about to put on the resin. That tiny bit of contamination will make it go milky and it won't stick as well. Just hold your breath!

Paul L 16th January 2013 20:32

Removable Frame & Body: made a good point on his build thread the other day about "thinking time".
I've also spend a lot of time thinking about my build (as anyone reading this thread can probably tell :rolleyes:).
Even though there is little to show for it, it gives me comfort when working out how to put this car together.

I know the whole re-body inspection process relies on the frame and body work being removable.
However, based on previous comments, this is based on theoretical, rather than practical, evidence.
( i.e. As long as there are visible brackets that appear bolted to the chassis, that is good enough. )

But the more I think about this, the more I want to make sure that I do nothing to prevent physical removal.
I have been putting a lot of thought into the rear of the car & there are a few areas I need to consider carefully.
These are the petrol tank, filler cap, the rear frame bolts themselves & the fuel hard line...

Access Behind Rear Cockpit Wall:
This was my 1st crude 'mock up' of the rear of the cockpit which will be "fitted" around my handbrake panel.

My understanding is that this panel is bonded / fibre glassed to both the floor & body shell for added strength.
So then it would be a case of cutting out a removable panel in this wall that would allow access behind it.

AndyP57 put a very discreet panel in his first demonstrator, for the fuel gauge wiring…

Mister Towed has a much bigger panel providing access to his luggage area…

Sorry, I feel another Goldilocks moment coming on...

"One panel is too big and the other one is too small...


So I will have a look at the weekend to see how easy it would be to reach the following from inside the cockpit:
- Petrol tank mounting bolts - Might need captive nuts at the rear of the frame rail.
- Rear framework mounting bolts - Hopefully these can be removed without removing the petrol tank.

The filler cap securing clips, fuel gauge wiring & the fuel line connection should all be easy to reach.
The fuel line itself is the next area I need to make some changes to…

Fuel Line:
I bought a cheap and cheerful pipe bending tool to re-route my hard fuel line to the new petrol tank location.
My initial plan was to bend it around the frame and clip it all in place before bonding the body shell on.
The downside to this plan is there would be no way to disconnect the pipe in order to remove the body. :icon_sad:

So new master plan is to use some of this flexible fuel hose instead…

I would need to cut the existing fuel hard line at, or slightly above, the chassis level.
I would then run this flexible hose from the hard line to the tank, clipping to the frame work along the way.
But by disconnecting both ends of the flexible hose there would be nothing to stop the body coming off.

I would just need a simple rubber grommet to seal the pipe into the new floor (see below).

Rear Body Work:
Without doubt, my biggest headache is the area underneath the bodywork, behind the rear cockpit wall.
I have spent a lot of time trying to come up with a solution that will resolve these issues:
- Somewhere to mount my twin exhaust silencers.
- Inner rear wheel arches.
- Protection of, and access to, the rear lighting mounting points and wiring.

But no matter what I try, I keep coming back to DonnySoutherner's re-using bits of Spitfire solution…
( Which is why the new Ribble Navigator demonstrator being bonded to the Spitfire tub works so well. )

I plan to send the first photo to Spitfire Graveyard shortly so they know what I am looking for when I ring them.
( As I had enough trouble trying to describe the headlight rims I wanted over the phone. :rolleyes: )
If the price is right, then this is the road I will go down to sort out the back of the car.

Cheers, Paul. :)

SeaNick - Thanks for the advice. :cool:
Although I might try wearing a mask rather than not breathing! :icon_wink:

Paul L 19th January 2013 09:24

Well the snow has finally arrived in London with a vengeance…

But as SeaNick said the other day, at least the photo would make a nice Christmas card.

At least there are still a few little jobs I can be getting on with indoors...

Front Indicator Earth Wire:
This was a very simple & straightforward job (who said there were none of these? :icon_wink: ).
There were three tiny bolts & nuts to remove to allow the bulb holder to be separated from the seal.
( I will not be using these to mount the indicator to the bonnet, I will use fittings a bit further apart. )

Then I just recycled a length of the excess wire I'd already removed from my loom into two lengths.
I had to cut a very small hole in the rubber seal to thread the new purple earth wire though before I started.
( I will be producing my own version of the wiring diagram which will list all colour coded wired used. )

I then crimped small 'O Ring' connectors to one end & bolted it to the outer bulb ring as the earth connection.
I just had to cut a small "V" out of the rim to allow the wire a new route in which wouldn't foul when fitted.

So another little job done, and the philosophy on this build is still that every job done counts. :cool:

Rimmer Bros. Delivery:
Another very fast delivery of a big box of bits from them...

Next Steps:
We are hoping to head off for a family Panto later this afternoon...

Oh no you're not!

Oh yes we are!


Although they did ask us to ring before hand to check it was did on.

But I have another couple of indoor jobs in mind if I get the chance.
( I'd dug out any bits & tools I might need from the bottom of the garden before the snow came. )

So until next time, take care, Paul. :)

garyh 19th January 2013 10:33

What's in the box?

Viatron 19th January 2013 10:38


Paul L 19th January 2013 11:31

Sorry, just realised my shopping list was on the previous page...


Originally Posted by Paul L (Post 38978)
Rimmer Bros - January Sale
I had built up a list of assorted small bits & pieces I needed and this seemed like a good time to order them.
- All the retaining bits for end of throttle cable (previous clip went missing & was the wrong part anyway).
- Choke cable (as there is some fraying on the outer surround on my donor's one).
- Olive for petrol tank "fuel out" pipe (as I need to turn this through 180 degree, given the tanks new location).
- Clips for fuel & brake lines (easier to get these now rather than source them separately).
- A couple of small enamel Union Jacks which I plan to fit either side of the car (final location TBC).

However, I also made one significant purchase at this time…

Didn't get a chance to open it yet as my sister & her family are due any minute for Panto.

Oh no there're not!

Oh yes they are!


Got to go, Paul. :icon_wink:

Mister Towed 19th January 2013 11:50

Nice work, good idea drawing up your own wiring diagram for future reference.

I've done a colour coded diagram of the mods to my loom, although, as I had a rather large reel of red 5 amp cable lying around, which I've used for everything, and could only find a blue pen when I drew up the diagram...

Paul L 20th January 2013 14:37

Front Indicator Earth Wire - Extra Photos:
Just a quick follow up to yesterday's post, I should have added extra "before" & "after" photos.
These are from the second indicator that needed to be done, showing where I made the cut...

Which leads me nicely into...

Front Indicator Mounting:
I still need to "mock up" the best location for this, but I already know I want a vertical mounting surface.
Mikmiglia had previously suggested one way of doing this, but this advice actually gave me another idea.
I've already collected some discarded sections of house insulation foam from nearby skips.
As I had a vague idea that I might stuff these inside the doors before adding some sort of interior door panel.

Then I remembered my Fibre Glassing Instruction DVD using foam as a mould to make a particular shape. *
So I decided to have a go at shaping some of this foam into the basis for my indicator mounts.

* OK, technically speaking, the DVD suggested making a fibre glass mould from the foam, then using that.
But that sounds like a lot of extra work to me & I don't have any gel coat to play with anyway. :rolleyes:
So it will have a rough fibre glass finish, which be be "smoothed" on the visible bonnet side with some filer.

I just had to bare in mind a few things before I started attacking the foam with a collection of sharp "toys":
- I wanted it to match the contours of the headlights, which appears shallower above & deeper below.

- I needed to make it deeper than required, so that I can trim the back to blend into the bonnet's contours.
( Although the deepest point will still be less than an inch to keep in step with headlight mounting point. )
- I actually need both a 'left' & a 'right' mould to take account of the bonnet shapes.

So I started by cutting off a slightly over sized cube from the insulation block…

I then used the indicator's outer chrome ring as a basic guide to mark a centre hole for drilling...

I used a wood working drill bit to cut a hole for the back of the indicator to go through...

Has any body used this type of drill bit to cut through their fibreglass bodywork?
Or do you have to use the cylinder type drill bits usually used on metal?

With the indicator's rubber seal pushed in place I could use a marker pen around the outside.
Which gives me the size of the vertical surface to starting working "back" from…

At this point I sliced the block horizontally to give me the two "sides" I would need.
So this left me with two sections that both looked like this to play with...

Then I slowly, but surely, whittled the foam down into something that looked like this...

I figured in the best Sammio tradition it didn't matter too much if it wasn't perfectly symmetrical. :icon_twisted:

I now need to confirm the final location for the indicators on the bonnet.
( Ideally as close to the "red circle" mock up in the bonnet photo above).

Then I need to do is to shape the foam's flat "bottom" to blend in with the bonnet's contours.
I also must work how thick the fibre glass will end up being after it is applied over the top of the mould.
As I will need to reduce the mould by this thickness, so the fibre glass ends up the required size (touch wood).

After that, I should be ready to have my first go at making something out of fibre glass. :cool:

Observation - Working With Foam :
This insulation foam is very easy to work with, a bit like a large cheesecake.
But the stuff gets everywhere & sticks to your clothes like iron fillings to a magnet!
I think I've spent more time cleaning up the mess than on the shaping work itself.

So another inch of progress made towards the finishing line.

Until next time, take care, Paul. :)

Mr T - At least if you have an electrical problem, chances are it will be a red wire at fault.

Viatron 20th January 2013 14:41

Nice job, any hole that big in fibreglass needs to be made by either stitch drilling and filing or using a hole saw.

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