Madabout Kitcars Forum

Madabout Kitcars Forum (http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/forum/index.php)
-   Tribute Automotive Builds (http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=18)
-   -   New Instruments from Grassbanks (http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7432)

Jaguartvr 6th August 2021 21:09

New Instruments from Grassbanks
 
1 Attachment(s)
That bugger Justin from Grassbanks has been tempting me with shiny bits, so nice do they look that I have had to pry my wallet open.
https://i.postimg.cc/15rJrfZr/231591...94725126-n.jpg
The beauty about these instruments is that they are plug and play, it all plugs into the back of your existing dash binnacle, not only the instruments but all the warning lights, these would take longer than instaling the instruments.

I have a car in the drive with an untrimmed interior almost ready, it has been sitting for a long time as I didn't want to do the wiring, it is a pig.

With the ETB instruments, you have to take an extra feed from the oil pressure sender for the oil pressure gauge. This is under the inlet manifold and even on a ramp is a pig to get to. Water temperature is taken from the block drain fitting which is much easier but still a faff. None of this is needed on the new Grassbanks setup.

When fitting the ETB instruments you need to take feed from the original binnacle to feed indicators, main beam, abs, oil pressure light etc etc, the easiest way to do this is to piggyback off the old bulb holders that fit in the back. The problem is the fittings use stainless steel so you can't solder to them. You have to solder directly to the thin flexible circuit board, this normally means burning through it and with all the connections is a labour of love.
Grassbanks has used the same idea but has 3d printed sockets that go directly into the existing bulb holder holes. Again so simple and so time saving.
Another great advantage is that the Grassbank speedo has an analogue odometer, the ETB version has an LCD digital display that gives the game away.

I am not going to get my hands on them until the end of the month but will give more feedback on them when I have them in my hands.
One thing people forget about is the time taken to swap all the BMW switches on the dash to more retro looking items, this is also being looked at with the idea of supplying a plug n play solution to all the switches.
He is also looking at doing the same set up for the Zagato and the Kobra although the Kobra will have to wait until a dash is available although I think the Zagato dash would work.

I will post some pictures of the prep done to install the new dash. I was going to use a Tribute dash which is much easier to fit but have opted for a heavily modified DNA dash, much harder to fit and more expensive but it's the way I'm going. If anyone wants a Tribute dash (or a highly modified DNA version) just let me know.

Lucky@LeMans 7th August 2021 09:13

Mick I sent you a pm !!

casamolino 7th August 2021 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaguartvr (Post 106716)
That bugger Justin from Grassbanks has been tempting me with shiny bits, so nice do they look that I have had to pry my wallet open.
https://i.postimg.cc/15rJrfZr/231591...94725126-n.jpg
The beauty about these instruments is that they are plug and play, it all plugs into the back of your existing dash binnacle, not only the instruments but all the warning lights, these would take longer than instaling the instruments.

I have a car in the drive with an untrimmed interior almost ready, it has been sitting for a long time as I didn't want to do the wiring, it is a pig.

With the ETB instruments, you have to take an extra feed from the oil pressure sender for the oil pressure gauge. This is under the inlet manifold and even on a ramp is a pig to get to. Water temperature is taken from the block drain fitting which is much easier but still a faff. None of this is needed on the new Grassbanks setup.

When fitting the ETB instruments you need to take feed from the original binnacle to feed indicators, main beam, abs, oil pressure light etc etc, the easiest way to do this is to piggyback off the old bulb holders that fit in the back. The problem is the fittings use stainless steel so you can't solder to them. You have to solder directly to the thin flexible circuit board, this normally means burning through it and with all the connections is a labour of love.
Grassbanks has used the same idea but has 3d printed sockets that go directly into the existing bulb holder holes. Again so simple and so time saving.
Another great advantage is that the Grassbank speedo has an analogue odometer, the ETB version has an LCD digital display that gives the game away.

I am not going to get my hands on them until the end of the month but will give more feedback on them when I have them in my hands.
One thing people forget about is the time taken to swap all the BMW switches on the dash to more retro looking items, this is also being looked at with the idea of supplying a plug n play solution to all the switches.
He is also looking at doing the same set up for the Zagato and the Kobra although the Kobra will have to wait until a dash is available although I think the Zagato dash would work.

I will post some pictures of the prep done to install the new dash. I was going to use a Tribute dash which is much easier to fit but have opted for a heavily modified DNA dash, much harder to fit and more expensive but it's the way I'm going. If anyone wants a Tribute dash (or a highly modified DNA version) just let me know.

Morning Jag , Justin does come up with some cracking bits of kit , i understand how a new Oil Pressure warning light could be easily connected but wouldn`t an Oil Pressure gauge still require a new sender unit fitted into one of the existing oil galleries? Geoff .

Jaguartvr 7th August 2021 11:34

Justin says you don't need one, the new gauge reads something from the original sender, it's all black magic to me but fitting an extension pipe with an additional take off for the new gauge on the ETB setup was a pain.
I will confirm this when they have been fitted.

I notice from the picture that there are warning lights on the oil and water gauges, I presume that these light up at a certain temperature/pressure. Pretty sure these weren't standard on the Z3 cluster.
Another problem with the ETB gauges was the fuel sender, just wasn't accurate even with the supplied resistor.

Having now fitted the Grassbanls dials I can confirm that the oil pressure gauge works perfectly.

casamolino 7th August 2021 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaguartvr (Post 106725)
Justin says you don't need one, the new gauge reads something from the original sender, it's all black magic to me but fitting an extension pipe with an additional take off for the new gauge on the ETB setup was a pain.
I will confirm this when they have been fitted.

I notice from the picture that there are warning lights on the oil and water gauges, I presume that these light up at a certain temperature/pressure. Pretty sure these weren't standard on the Z3 cluster.
Another problem with the ETB gauges was the fuel sender, just wasn't accurate even with the supplied resistor.

When i did the instruments on mine i had that extn piece fitted into the oil gallery and had oil pressure and oil temp senders fitted into it , Geoff .

redratbike 7th August 2021 12:06

are they 1200?

sure i have read that somewhere

Jaguartvr 7th August 2021 13:02

price TBA, 1200 only for the first 2 sets, sorry, 1 set:laugh:

Jaguartvr 20th August 2021 09:18

First picture of my instruments
https://i.postimg.cc/cJDhn0Lh/PHOTO-...7-14-20-31.jpg
Very pleased they look great and can't wait to get my hands on them.
One of the things that I really like is the traditional odometer, the LCD screen on the ETB instruments was a big letdown, gave the game away instantly.
The odometer is actually an hours indicator rather than miles the same as used on a boat.
Now looking for problems, my car is on a limited mileage policy so if there was ever a claim I wouldn/t like to give them a reason not to payout.
I have asked Grassbanks to sent the new speedo at zero and will take a picture of the current mileage at this point. I will then be able to compare the "hours" to "miles". The original binnacle is hidden behind the new dash so you can always check the mileage but a bit of a faff.
Now you can get those Bluetooth OB2 readers that plugin under the dash and are read by your smart phone, they all have different features. Does anyone know of a version that shows the mileage? Would be a very good way of knowing the exact mileage for the insurance company without having to pull the dash. Take a screenshot every MOT and you are covered.

One thing I am not so keen on is the labelling on the idiot lights on the speedo and rev counter, ASC/DSC gives the game away and it looks a little odd that the small instruments are labelled in Italian but the idiot lights in English. I would like to see the idiot lights unlabeled. Also 3 lights on each dial so that front fogs could be included. The idiot lights are feed from the idiot light sockets on the back of the original cluster so you could simply plug one of Grassbanks adapters into the cluster and connect it to the idiot light of your choice, this way you could have one of the lights connected to the MIL warning or whatever warning you wanted.
Small point but doesn't detract from the overall effect.

molleur 20th August 2021 12:06

Very nice indeed!

Jaguartvr 20th August 2021 13:03

A few pictures of the loosley positioned dahboard, it needs to be leather covered.https://i.postimg.cc/vZ1MxHh8/dash.jpg
The dash is partly held in position by the front of the heater cover panel. This extends to the floor on both sides and up to the front bulkhead which makes it all very stable. It also allows you to fit the existing heater controls. The existing rotary controls are a tad short so I 3d printed some which worked but the finish wasn't great so I am working on some alloy ones.https://i.postimg.cc/y6P7wGWK/front-bulkhead-fit.jpg
I have had made an alloy plinth to take the smaller instruments, apart from looking good the advantage is that you can fit the instruments to the plinth first and then install the plinth into the dash assembly in one go, much easier.
Trimming the inside of the alloy plinth with leather proved to be an absolute pain so I had an insert 3d printed, this way you stick the leather to the insert and then trim it, much easier and then the insert is held in by the instruments. I had to make the insert in 2 halves due to the size of my printer.https://i.postimg.cc/XJ6VbSwj/alloy-inset-panel.jpg
I haven't gone into details about removing the dash as I did it ages ago and have forgotten most of it, I have however just been reminded that there are 2 hidden allen screws that are hare to spot and a pain to remove.

Jaguartvr 14th September 2021 15:37

WOW

Instruments have just arrived, beautifully packaged and presented.
Everything is clearly labelled and looks so professionally made. I have fitted ETB gauges but these are in a different league.
I wasn't keen on the original labeling on the speedo and rev counter but this has been changed and looks much better.
Feast your eyeshttps://i.postimg.cc/76rC1B2m/IMG-4784.jpghttps://i.postimg.cc/Y0bhHMys/IMG-4785.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/hvSf6fMm/IMG-4786.jpghttps://i.postimg.cc/QtgFfpgs/IMG-4787.jpg

Jaguartvr 17th September 2021 15:14

2 wires to solder
On the white dash plug
red/yellow solder to new plug red/yellow
From blue dash plug
violet/yellow to grey new plug

I hate soldering but both plugs (with the dash out) will reach to the bonnet which makes soldering much easier.

Everything plugs together nicely and most of the lights seem to work, can't check the rest yet as the battery is dead flat and there's no petrol in it.

Jaguartvr 18th September 2021 13:57

https://i.postimg.cc/Bvvz65p6/IMG-4800.jpg

Plugged the instruments in and everything working. This has been a job that I was dreading having known how much work the ETB instruments. were. Piece of piss, solder 2 wires, few plugs and you are done!
They look absolutely superb, Justin at Grassbanks really has outdone himself this time.
I still have to get the dash covered as I'm not keen on the painted Finnish so still a bit of work to finish.

Not part of the dash but I thought I would share my door openers.
Classic Mini door opener mounted on a plate that is screwde to the door, the original door rod is cut and bent and threaded through the door opener hole. The door rod needs to be slightly under tension otherwise there isn't enough "Pull" to open it.
<a href='https://postimg.cc/H82kJb1q' target='_blank'><img src='https://i.postimg.cc/H82kJb1q/IMG-4791.jpg' border='0' alt='IMG-4791'/></a>https://i.postimg.cc/pT6nDvK8/IMG-4792.jpghttps://i.postimg.cc/t70ZMzS4/IMG-4791.jpg

Munky 20th September 2021 02:47

Nice! Thanks for posting your progress.
I’m still hoping to follow in your shoes eventually!

Jaguartvr 3rd November 2021 12:35

Small amount of progress but a few teething problems that were to be expected.
The instruments when viewed at night were too dim and the speedo and rev counter were fine at the top but too dark at the bottom do they went back to Grassbank for some work. They came back with additional bulbs fitted that has made a big difference.
I had fitted the instruments in the car and also in the dash but on the table. Sandy on the Z3roadster forum (he still cannot post on this forum) has reported problems in fitting the original Z3 cluster behind the new dashboard. I couldn't see a problem so decided to show him how it is done (smug grin). However, in trying to fit it all it turns out he was right (smug grin wiped off). The only way to get the Z3 cluster to fit behind the crash bar and under the new dash is to cut the drivers side demist tube, not ideal but I can nake it back in grp matt but 2" shallower. With this done the Z3 dash will lay flat but only gives a few mm of wiggle room. Grassbank has used the Lusso style dash, this sits higher than the Tribute (which Sandy is using) or a modified DNA dash that I am using.
I then cut up a second BMW dash and fitted it without the new dash bonded on to see if I could gain any more room, it is hard to see with the new dash on. The positioning of the Z3 dash is determined by the dash vent tubes, the dash rests on these and they can't be moved or the air will escape inside the dash rendering the demist useless. There is no spare room so cutting the drivers vent tube down to make it thinner us the only answer.

https://i.postimg.cc/bYT4fG48/IMG-4923.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/dtVpssKC/IMG-4930.jpg

In trying to fit the Z3 cluster, new instruments and new dashboard to the car itself I hit another snag, the new wiring loom just wasn't long enough. When I fitted the instruments and loom to the dash on the table it looked fine. However, because the original Z3 dash can only be fitted in one position the loom is just too short, move it a bit and it is too short in another area. Modifications needed have been marked and returned for a few alterations. After this has been done I am pretty confident that it will fit both the Tribute and DNA dashboards, there will probably be a bit to much loom but better to tuck it away behind the dash than be too short.
The ideal position for the Z3 cluster would be behind the glove box, however the 3 plugs that go into it won't reach so all the wires would have to be lengthened, about 50 wires, this would defeat the object of plug n play so is not an option.
Probably the easiest option will be to fit the Lusso style dash but no pricing on it yet. The panel on this dash has a lift off section just above the speedo and rev counter and is raised. This gives more room for the Z3 cluster, better access for the wiring and makes trimming the top section a job you can do yourself without having to pay to have it trimmed.

redratbike 3rd November 2021 21:31

so what you need is the 3 plugs on a mini loom to extend them in a plug and play style with the appropriate male and female plugs rather than extending individual wires by cutting and soldering

Jaguartvr 4th November 2021 09:20

That would be ideal but I wouldnt think the sockets to enable you to extend the cable would be available. The extra labour to crimp and solder about 50 wires would I fear be too expensive. Shame because if you could move the Z3 cluster to the passenger side you might be able to position it so the odometer and service lights were visible.

The main point in fitting these instruments is the plug n play factor.


All times are GMT +0. The time now is 18:35.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright Madabout Kitcars 2014