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Go Back   Madabout Kitcars Forum > Mad Build Area > General Build Chat

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  #1  
Old 22nd April 2010, 21:26
burge124 burge124 is offline
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Default pinto engine help please!

Hi I have just re-build a pinto engine and after trying to start, I discovered a problem with ignition system.

After repairing the dissy I was turning the engine over to find the ignition stroke on No.1 with my finger and discovered that I had no compression at all. Put the compression tester in and still zero compression on No.1.

Took the cam cover off and found that there is a load of white and red gunk all over. Possibly the red bits been from rust and maybe white from oil and water? Smells a little of fuel but might not be. Does fuel and water go white?

Took the sump off and it’s again full of white oily stuff. Checked the head and it seems fine. Values seem to fit in their seats perfectly well. Head gasket seems fine too, no damage.

Just had the value seats recut for unleaded, although I don't think they could have damaged anything that could break into an oil stream?

It could have been possible that some water got down the oil down pipe whilst installing the head although It seems allot more than a bit. In the sump I found at least a cup full of standing water or fuel with the white oil sitting on top of it.

Poured some water into the bores to see if it was the rings, tried turning the crank over a little to see if it slips down although it didn't. Would you get some compression at all if the head gasket was leaking? Baring in mind never been started just turned over (a lot though).

Don't know what else to try. Scared of just putting it all back together and it doing it again. Really need to find out why. Can valves stick open slightly? Just don't understand the compression lost.

This engine has been skimmed quite a bit on the head for high compression. Was bought built for race spec. When I first put it together I had compression.

Also I might have really badly flooded the engine. Was desperate to start it. Didn't realise we had ignition problems. Not sure what impact this could have.

Any help would be fantastic. Thanks in advance.

Dan
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  #2  
Old 23rd April 2010, 07:26
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GreatOldOne GreatOldOne is offline
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Oily white stuff sounds like mayonaisse to me. I'm not aware petrol and water can mix like that.

As for loss of compression, and the fuel in the sump - have your piston rings slipped round so that the gaps are aligning or near to aligning? if there isn't a good seal any more, that could account for no compression and the unburnt fuel ending up in the oil.
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  #3  
Old 23rd April 2010, 08:36
chrislandy chrislandy is offline
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I would do a quick strip and rebuild on it, especially if it's a race engine. If it's been stood for a while the Mayo may be from condensation in the block mixing with the oil rather than hgf.
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Old 23rd April 2010, 10:05
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Chris Cussen Chris Cussen is offline
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No compression at all seems to indicate a valve is stuck open. Try turning the engine over slowly by hand with the plugs out and the rocker cover off and check all the valves are going up and down. Check the clearance of the valves on No.1 cylinder. If there is no clearance then the valve will leak and you will get no compression.

The mayo could be caused by condensation - but if you are putting everything back together after you have cured the lack of compression then do an oil change and keep an eye on water/oil levels when you finally get the engine running.
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Old 23rd April 2010, 15:43
burge124 burge124 is offline
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Hi how would a value stick open? What would cause it? Did feel that way. I think I know why we had mayo. Could have been a mistake when I first took the head off. Didn't drain everything first and someone said that could have dropped down into it. Oops.

Still cant seem to figure out the compression problem. Didn't check the other cylinders. Should have I guess.
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Old 23rd April 2010, 18:05
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Chris Cussen Chris Cussen is offline
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Well the valve could stick if the clearance is a bit tight, or the valvestem is a tight fit and/or bent. I have to admit I have only had that problem on a petrol lawnmower. But I have had the problem of a valve not closing properly when I have the valve gap wrong after having the head skimmed. You need to check the valve gaps to make sure they are correct ( I don't know the figures for a pinto engine, but in the days when I had a mini the gaps were in the order of 12-15 thousands of an inch.)

Try the compression on the other cylinders, it may give you a clue.
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Old 26th April 2010, 07:19
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eaa53 eaa53 is offline
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Default So what exactly did you do?

Dan

There is something lost in translation here…. Also I think you have more then one problem.

Okay first, can you confirm that the engine is mounted in a car and was working before you started?
Second do I understand it correctly that you removed the head without removing the coolant?
Third you fitted this replacement head and then found these problems?

You do not get water (standing water) in the sump from a stuck valve! I assume you know the difference between water and petrol and it is water.

If it was petrol and the engine was turned over you would get weak oil not white mayo.

If it is assumed that you dropped water into the sump from the head removal then that is sorted by changing the oil and flushing through with fresh oil and replacing the oil again.

Did the engine try to fire at all? If it was only one cylinder faulty it would have fired on the other 3 and started although very lumpy.

How did you set the ignition timing and did you get the correct distributor lead to the correct cylinder plug?

The no compression issue; assuming the head was fitted down properly it could be tappet clearance or wrong valve timing. The valve timing is set at TDC with the notch on the crank pulley lined up with the pointer on the aluminium crank seal cover, and then the cam pulley pointer lined up with the spot on the head immediately below the cam shaft, viewed through the cam pulley usually with a mirror if it’s in the car.

I routinely mark all these pointers and dots with white point as I rebuild.

Now which bit did you not do?
Cold tappet clearances?
Setting the valve timing?
Ignition timing?

More information required I think before we can help further.
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  #8  
Old 26th May 2010, 18:53
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Remember on the Pinto that when replacing the head the cylinder head bolt holes in the block must be perfectly clean and dry. If you torque down a bolt in to a hole which contains water or oil then it will torque out when the bolt touches the water/oil surface. You will think that you have torqued the head down correctly but it could be raised on its gasket due to the above problem.
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