Windscreen wiper motor - Page 5

GreatOldOne · #81 7th June 2010, 12:12

I started work fitting the washer system yesterday. I couldn't use the washer bottle kit I got from CBS at Stoneliegh, as the only place it'd fit was directly above the exhaust... I didn't fancy having to clean melted plastic from the pipes.

I've followed Robin's lead, and used a Alu water bottle from Millets (£3!) - but I have mounted mine horizontally in a cradle on top of the scuttle above the pedal box.

I've bonded a spigot into the cap and drilled a small hole on the shoulder of the bottle to allow air in as the water is pumped out. There's a dip tube inside on the other end of the spigot, which I've weighted down with some stainless washers to ensure it staus on the bottom.

To fill it, I take it out of the cradle, spin the bottle to get the lid off and then pour the fluid in. Spin the lid back on, and lay it back in the cradle with the vent hole facing up. Simples.

Just waiting on some nyon webbing and some adjustable plastic clips (like on rucksacks) to arrive to secure the bottle in the cradle.

I also need a decent one way valve... the one I got from halfrauds was a non-way valve. I could barely get it to open by blowing through it... :/

I'll get some piccies later on.

MartinClan · #82 7th June 2010, 12:40

Sounds like a cunning plan....

Be careful with your choice of pump - I got through three before I found one that would work without priming.

Robin

GreatOldOne · #83 7th June 2010, 12:44

The pump I have already self primes - It just couldn't push the fluid past the non way valve.

GreatOldOne · #84 8th June 2010, 10:01

I thought I had posted these last night, but obviously the gremlins did for them after I hit the submit button...

Anyway - pics of the bottle:

I need to get some sort of label (that will withstand the rigours of the engine compartment) to stick on it that has the washer symbol on it. Anyone know where I could get one?

Patrick · #85 8th June 2010, 12:38

He he looks like a fire system

GreatOldOne · #86 8th June 2010, 12:42

Yeah - I did toy with the idea of getting a blue one, and slapping a NOS sticker on it.

GreatOldOne · #87 11th June 2010, 08:33

Questions before I start fitting the wipers tommorow:

1) How did everyone bend the arms of the wipers? Vice plus brute strength? If so I guess I'd need to cover the vice jaws so I don't mar the chrome...
2) Approx. how much needs cutting off an arm? From Peter's pics, it looks like an inch or so.
3) Wiring - I've got the lucas wiring details for motor, so that shouldn't be an issue - but when it comes to the washer jets - how did you wire that up? Just the jets when you pull back on the stalk, or jet + wiper? Did anyone get intermittant working, and if so, how?

Wiring diags would be nice

GreatOldOne · #88 11th June 2010, 12:55

On the wiring front, I've sat down with the wiring PDF:

http://www.armchair.mb.ca/~dave/BMW/e30/e30_86.pdf (page 6160-0)

at work and realised that I need K10... Which I think I've thrown away.

That being the case, and once I've got another, everything should go together as per the diagram I have. Bar the wiper motor that is.

I've worked out that:

Motor PIN 1 (Earth) -> Earth
Motor PIN 2 (Park) -> K10 'F1' (Slow input)
Motor PIN 3 (Fast) -> K10 '53b'
Motor PIN 5 (Slow) -> K10 '53'

But where does PIN 4 (Live) go to? K10 terminal '15' needs to be fed when the ign. is in ACY, Run or Start, so that will come off terminal 20 (dedicated wiper power) on my CBS wiring panel. Should Pin 4 of the motor be tied to that as well?

peterux · #89 12th June 2010, 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreatOldOne

Questions before I start fitting the wipers tommorow:

1) How did everyone bend the arms of the wipers? Vice plus brute strength? If so I guess I'd need to cover the vice jaws so I don't mar the chrome...
2) Approx. how much needs cutting off an arm? From Peter's pics, it looks like an inch or so.
3) Wiring - I've got the lucas wiring details for motor, so that shouldn't be an issue - but when it comes to the washer jets - how did you wire that up? Just the jets when you pull back on the stalk, or jet + wiper? Did anyone get intermittant working, and if so, how?

Wiring diags would be nice

Hi Jason,
1) yes, I bent mine by hand in the vice. I think my wiper arms are stainless so no visible damage.
2) That's about right. My arms are the adjustable type so the amount I cut off was not critical and also depends on exactly where your spindle holes are positioned.
3) Sorry can't help, as mine are very simple. I 'click' on the wiper switch for wipers and 'click' on the washer push buttun if I want both

...peter

Rich · #90 12th June 2010, 08:10

1. Ours were the same as Peters, just bend in the vice. Wrap the metal in a cloth to avoid damaging the surface.

2. Our wipers are not adjustable so the length had to be right. That took a bit of time to measure. We just held the wipers up to the screen once the arms were bent. To make it a little easier you can take the spring out of the wiper arm.

3. I don't remember exactly how I wired it up. But I do remembering using a relay on the park signal to change it from -ve to +ve (I think it was that way round). Also the intermittent mode doesn't work as it would need a separate timer. The BMW wiper motor has that built in. We decided it wasn't that important and all functions work except intermittent:
- single wipe
- park
- slow
- fast
- wash + wipe

Aside from the London to Briton last year they've only had a little use.

Patrick · #91 12th June 2010, 10:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich

Aside from the London to Briton last year they've only had a little use.

We could have used a set on the inside too

MartinClan · #92 13th June 2010, 19:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreatOldOne

On the wiring front, I've sat down with the wiring PDF:

http://www.armchair.mb.ca/~dave/BMW/e30/e30_86.pdf (page 6160-0)

at work and realised that I need K10... Which I think I've thrown away.

That being the case, and once I've got another, everything should go together as per the diagram I have. Bar the wiper motor that is.

I've worked out that:

Motor PIN 1 (Earth) -> Earth
Motor PIN 2 (Park) -> K10 'F1' (Slow input)
Motor PIN 3 (Fast) -> K10 '53b'
Motor PIN 5 (Slow) -> K10 '53'

But where does PIN 4 (Live) go to? K10 terminal '15' needs to be fed when the ign. is in ACY, Run or Start, so that will come off terminal 20 (dedicated wiper power) on my CBS wiring panel. Should Pin 4 of the motor be tied to that as well?

I managed to use the BMW wiring almost unmodified and I have all the functions (including intermittent) which the K10 relay seems to sort out.

As I remember I just had to supply a separate live as the BMW wiring switches the earth.

Here is a picture of the internal connections of a Lucas motor - it may help.

As I remember, The BMW wiring effectively connects the park circuit to the slow speed when you turn the wipers off.

Robin

GreatOldOne · #93 13th June 2010, 21:28

Excellent - I managed to get a K10 from an e30 dismantler on Friday, so I'll start hooking it up this coming week.

In connecting the slow speed to park, does that mean that I need to connect terminal 2 of the motor to F1, and then pin 4 to earth? or does pin 4 got to live and then it earths itself through F1 on the K10?

MartinClan · #94 14th June 2010, 12:36

Assuming that you are wiring it using the BMW wiper switch...

Pin 4 of the motor to earth and pin 2 to F1 of the relay. The park switch just behaves as the "slow" switch - until it parks.

It's always wise to put a lowish value fuse in the circuit to start - just in case....

The K10 should provide all the functions, slow, fast, intermittant and wash wipe - just as on the original BMW.

You may have to adjust the park postion - I need to on mine but I haven't investigated how to do it yet. As a result my wipers park about 5deg into wipe rather that at the bottom.

Robin

GreatOldOne · #95 14th June 2010, 13:55

Thanks Robin.

GreatOldOne · #96 16th June 2010, 21:39

Arms and wipers mounted.
Motor mounted.
K10, wiper stalk and motor all wired up and working. (single wipe, wash wipe, intermittent & both wipe speeds)

All I need now is some bundy tube and I'll be able to see if I've got all the measurements right. I'll order a set from SVC tomorrow.

Chris Cussen · #97 17th June 2010, 07:26

A hint that I was given in the final stages of putting my wipers together was prior to fitting the arms and blades was:
Using blu-tack put some straws/cocktail sticks on the spindles so you can observe the sweep without the risk of damaging anything.

GreatOldOne · #98 17th June 2010, 11:01

Good idea.

When I was ordering the bundy tube this morning, The SVC man also sugested that I don't use a saw on the drive cable when I come to cut it down, as the cable will fray. He sugested a file instead.

I was going to use the same method as Peter - cold chisel and an f'ing big hammer.

MartinClan · #99 17th June 2010, 13:02

Sharp cold chisel is the best way. Just make sure there is nothing fragile with the target area as the bit you cut off tends to move with alarming speed...

Robin

NigelB · #**100** 26th July 2013, 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by MartinClan

Here is a picture of the internal connections of a Lucas motor - it may help.

As I remember, The BMW wiring effectively connects the park circuit to the slow speed when you turn the wipers off.

Robin

Hi Robin,

This thread is a bit old now but I have had an afternoon trying to get my "park" to work and I've got brain ache.

I have the Lucas 14W motor and am using the BMW stalk. I have fast, slow and flick wipe working fine. But the park function is beating me.

Looking at your diagram pins 2 and 4 provide the park function. Assuming slow speed operation, 12v is applied to pin 5 via the stalk switch. There is also a permanent 12v on pin 4. For approx. 330 degrees of the main wiper drive gear that 12v on pin 4 is switched through to pin 2. Only when the drive gear is in the park segment of its rotation, the internal switch is depressed (open circuit) and the 12v is removed from pin 2.

In the absence of any wiring diagrams I have connected pins 2 an 5 (on your diagram) together. In slow speed operation, the slow speed switch on the stalk and the internal park switch are in parallel and are both closed except during the park segment of main wiper drive gear, when the park switch is open circuit. But because the two switches are in parallel the wipers are still on as a result of the 12v from the slow speed switch. (pin 5)

When the stalk switch is turned off that removes the 12v from that side of the parallel switches to the motor. However, the 12 from pin 4 via the park switch to pin 2 and then pin 5, ensures the motor will drive round to the park position. Once it reaches the park position, the park switch will become open circuit, removing the 12v at pin 2 (and pin 5) and the motor will stop. And that all seems to work just fine (with the drive gear removed and my finger acting as the cam on the drive gear!!)

However, with my finger still on the park switch, replicating the normal "rest" position, if I then switch the stalk switch to slow, the wiper fuse blows.

And that really confuses me. All I've got is two 12v switches in parallel. Each switched supply works fine independently but when I select slow speed from the park position the fuse blows.

Sorry for the long winded explanation. It probably needs reading a few times before it makes sense, but if it makes sense can you see any reason for the fuse blowing. I'm struggling........................!!

And then to confuse me even more I spoke to SVC this afternoon and they said that I should have 12v connected TO both pins 2 and 4. That didn't make any sense at all but in desperation I tried it. And blew the fuse.

Can anyone explain what is connected to the five pins. Not what they do, but whether they are supply or earth or where they are connected to.

Any help would be greatly appreciated because at the moment I'm thinking of swapping out the motor itself and that's a bit expensive if there' nothing wrong with it!!

Many thanks

Nigel