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Go Back   Madabout Kitcars Forum > Mad Build Area > Sammio Builds and discussions

Sammio Builds and discussions Sammio bodied car builds and specials

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  #1  
Old 31st August 2013, 20:52
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default 2CV Sammio build Tne Netherlands

Hello Fellow Sammio buiders,

I'd like to introduce myself, my name is Marcel Birkhoff, 44jrs, married and 2 kids (4-6yrs) and have imported the no.3 sammio Cheveaux body to the Netherlands. Initially I wanted to build a Burton kit car, a very well finished and popular 2cv kit of which are more then a 1000!! sold in the Netherlands. However, when I saw the Sammio I fell in love with the design and cancelled my Burton order!

I have followed this forum from time to time a bit but could not find any thing on the 2cv's but did learn some good things from the Herald based kits. However, I recently noticed that there is a Sammio 2cv builder in France - Zebre - which has made great progress and with whom i can share my frustrations and do some comparisons!

I'm at 70% of the build and have overcome the main issues and am very close to attach the body and do the final part.

Before I show you some pics, let me tell what has to be adapted to the kit, especially "handy for Andy"

Frame:
The Frame that was delivered with the kit fitted remarkably well. I did not have to change the mounting positions. However, the body would not fit over it and I had to move the rear crossmember (behind seats) back about 7 cm's.

Also it was very difficult to fit the pedal box and had to do a lot of cutting to make it fit.

When I had everything assembled at the chassis I found that I had too little legroom, although I'm not too tall (1,78cm). I noticed that the frame could be moved another 5cm forward on the chassis which is meant extra legroom!

Therefore I decided to dismount all components again and cut the frame and add 5 cm to the frame, cut the pedal box loose again and add another 2-3 cm by moving the pedal box forward.

Then when I fitted the body, the rear was very loose and not so easy to fix to the body. Therefore I have added some extra rear support - also as I want to make a booth lid that includes the two humps and opens to the back.

Also Have have made already some adaptations to the frame to be able to fit the doors - this you could actually do standard on this frame as it does not take a lot of weight and the structure is strong. Also i have added seatbelt mounting brackets.

Body:

The body is not very well finished and found that the rear was not straight and the left front is 4 cm longer as the right front. I had to cut out a piece from the front to make left and right symmetrical.

Also I had ordered a left steer model and upon delivery fond they had made a right steer body... I refused to take the body and Gary made an extra hump overnight which I put on.

For the citroen2cv a number of major adaptations have to be made, here's the list:

- replace location of alternator (to avoid bubble in bonnet)
- re-engineer steering column
- make new headboard
- Re-engineer exhaust system
- New airfilter system
- New fuel filler system
- New gear shift system
and tons of small stuff.

An advice for other 2cv builders, the burtoncar company has a lot of good solutions that will fit this build. see www.burtoncar.com

When I started, I bought and old to 2cv, and took of the parts I could use: suspension, axles, engine, gearbox, fuelsystem, electrical parts etc. The chassis was completely rotten.
So I bought a new chassis and main cable loom and got a refurbished engine / gearbox.

Next message will have some pictures after I have figured out how to reduce the size...
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  #2  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:02
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default

So as promised , here the pics
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  #3  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:39
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default teardown of 2cv

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So these are the parts which were useable..


Now cleaning up engine, taking rust of all parts, replace seals, bearings etc and repaint again..


Had to use a hydraulic wrench (700 bar)from work to loosen nuts of the drive shafts...They easily came loose....

Days of cleaning and realizing not a great deal was re-usable..
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  #4  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:42
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default Start with new chassis & rebuilt engine

Now the easy part began - built up the chassis - I was still smiling...
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg P6190060.jpeg (40.0 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpeg P8150007.jpeg (39.5 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpeg P8150008.jpeg (36.1 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpeg P8210009.jpeg (36.4 KB, 17 views)
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  #5  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:45
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default start with brand new chassis..

P6190060.jpeg

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P8210009.jpeg

Now the easy part began - built up the chassis - I was still smiling...
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  #6  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:46
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars'69 View Post
Now the easy part began - built up the chassis - I was still smiling...
Love that last picture

Welcome to the fold Mars.
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  #7  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:49
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default Start with putting one frame

2011-12-11 16.54.35 2.jpeg

2011-12-11 16.53.36.jpeg

Image.jpg

Image 5.jpg

Image 3.jpg

Problems with rear crossmember - have to cut it and move 5 cm back, also pedal box does not fit.. However, the mounting positions are very good and the frame is very straight!
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  #8  
Old 31st August 2013, 21:59
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default Continue with frame / floor

Nice thing about front wheel drive is that you do not have to worry about making a tunnel for the drive shaft and there is more room inside. Also the seats will be mounted in line with the humps.. Challenge is to find seats that are not higher as 47cm...

I used alu checkered plate for the floor, head and rear board and it gives a very sturdy feel to it, can easily stand on the floor without flexing it.
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg 2012-03-17 13.06.17.jpeg (25.8 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpeg 2011-12-30 15.22.17.jpeg (38.3 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpeg 2012-03-17 12.53.10.jpeg (31.0 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpeg 2011-12-30 16.44.08.jpeg (38.0 KB, 11 views)
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  #9  
Old 31st August 2013, 22:02
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default floor continued..

2011-12-11 16.54.35.jpeg

2012-03-17 13.06.17.jpeg

2012-03-17 12.53.10.jpeg

2011-12-30 16.44.08.jpeg

2011-12-30 17.10.49.jpeg

this was very satisfying!
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  #10  
Old 31st August 2013, 22:21
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default more modifications

Tried to fit the body, but had to cut and move back rear crossmember.2011-12-11 16.53.29.jpg

2011-12-11 16.53.22.jpg

Image 2.jpg

Image 4.jpg
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  #11  
Old 31st August 2013, 22:35
Mars'69 Mars'69 is offline
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Default Body modifications - fenders, hump

Now that the body fits, its time to add the extra hump I got from Gary. I had no experience whatsoever with glassing, but it worked out okay - still a messy job and itchy arms afterwards..

2011-12-26 15.54.44.jpeg

I had been thinking about the inner mudguards/fenders and found some plastic fenders from a citroen Mehari.

They fit both on front and rear, and are super light. I'm sure for the rear ones it could be a good solution for the Herald builders as well. I have now mounted them with some bolts to the sammio but will use them as a cast and glass them. Then I will take the plastic ones out and then I should have some nice glassfiber fenders which I can easily attach to the (glassfiber) floor of the rear. It will make the body very stiff I think.

Afbeelding 3.jpg

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Afbeelding.jpeg

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Starting to look like something...
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  #12  
Old 31st August 2013, 22:40
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Default Good inner fender / mudguard

Here;s a good picture of the mehari inner fender. I have two old ones at the rear and bought two new ones for the front..

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I still have to figure out how to fix them at the front as it is a bit "wobbly" and the bonnet has to fit neatly over them
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  #13  
Old 31st August 2013, 22:51
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Default Steering, gearshift and dash

I had to make a new steering column, which had to be firmly fixed to the frame and figure a good gear shift system. I used the parts from Burton car company and they came out really nice and sturdy. I have no really good pic of gearshift system it but will post it in the future.

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Also found a good solution to the handbrake - on the floor in gearshift system. With 2cv the handbrake works on front wheels. Was also able to fitt the choke control in there (chrome knob)

Also adjusted the Dash and pre-fitted the instruments

IMG_0739.jpeg

things are moving slowly with all this re-engineering / re-inventing...
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  #14  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:04
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Default Engine modifications

One issue with the 2cv is the height of air filter, alternator and oil filler/breather unit. I had to reposition the location of the altenator which wash't a simple operation but came out good.

I wanted to avoid the bubble in the bonnet like this one has..

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and welded a bracket to the engine support

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On the last pic you can see the original place of altenator and oil filler.. Hob bout that HUGE air filter.....
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  #15  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:21
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Default Seats & belts

I have looked every where to find low back seats. The 2cv does not have lowered floor pans - not possible as it has a straight ladder chassis - and therefore the seating position is higher. Subsequently the seats will interfere with the head rest on the humps. So the key is to find seat that are very low but still offer some comfort. You do not want to tower out above the windscreen..

In the end I called Intatrim in the UK and asked if they could supply their Apollo model seat with a lower rear height. It cost 20 pound extra I believe but they fitted perfectly when they arrived. The only thing is that the seats are really narrow while I would have had space for a wider model. Its still OK, but if your bottom is a bit wide its not that comfortable. I could either widen the seat or lose some weight (and thats what I did...) Now they sit excellent!

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Also bought the Sabelt seat belts - I did have to have to weld some mounting brackets.

IMG_0838-1.jpg
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  #16  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:31
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Default Battery and electrics

Initially I wanted to mount the battery at the front, under the bonnet, but space is limited there and I really liked the battery box solution I saw on the net. Also it improves weight distribution front-rear a bit and gives the battery a lower center of gravity.

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Also had to make a main power safety switch - fits exactly between the seats.
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  #17  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:41
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Default Engine / exhaust modifications

As earlier mentioned, the original 2cv engine has a HUGE air filter. After some surfing, I found this open air filter which - after some "Dremel" modifications -fitted. It will stick out through the bonnet, so I need to make a good "scoop" for it.

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Made a start with the bonnet hinges as well..

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Also had to cut and re-weld the exhaust as it was touching the wheel in full lock position.
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  #18  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:48
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Default Front body modifications

After test fitting the body again in combination with the bonnet, I found it to be really asymmetrical and found the left front to be 4cm longer as the right. How is this possible????? I hope this is fixed for new body shells..

Anyway, I cut the piece out, but it needs to be done very carefully.....

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Also looking at some positions for the rear lights. I think that 2 side by side still looks the best

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  #19  
Old 31st August 2013, 23:53
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Default fuel filler cap

Another challenge is to find a solution for the filler cap. Could not use the citroen system. Found a nice flexible filler hose and copper elbow - all fits nice and snug and the chome cap is the finishing touch

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  #20  
Old 1st September 2013, 00:11
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Default Major decision..

Okay - I was going along just fine, ready for final mounting of the body and before doing so I re-checked my seating position carefully and found it to be very uncomfy.... My pedals were just too close and my knees were touching the Dash almost. Not smart to leave t that way...

I looked for a solution and noticed the frame could still move forward about 4-5 cm to the front. At the same time I could also move the pedal box a bit (3 cm) to the front and gain in total about 8cm which make a big difference. You can lose weight, but not height...

I decided to dismantle the whole dash, electrics, panels etc and then cut the 10 linking bars on the frame. The whole front was loose now - ouch! - then repositioned all and weld it again. Set me back some weeks as frame need painting again and new floor and headboard panels need to be made.

Good thing is that the seating position greatly improved with this operation...

Andy should really adapt the frame as there is room for on the chassis.

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